Pages: [1] 2   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Titanium Strings  (Read 2321 times)
edgeguy
Senior Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 124




Ignore
« on: March 17, 2008, 02:41:26 PM »

Has anybody heard of these guitar strings and given them a try on their Larrivee.  Suppose to last a lot longer and not rust compared to regular acoustic strings.

http://www.rohrtech.com/

Thanks
Logged

Larrivee OM-03 MQ
Johnny M
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1455


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2008, 06:40:13 PM »

I've never had a problem with rust as they wear out way before they can rust.  They seem pretty pricy, so I'll stick with my Newtones as I love the sound and feel of them.  I would like to hear though if anyone has tried them and what they think of them.

John
Logged

...A couple of beautiful guitars...

Not all those who wander are lost ...
http://denmankayaks.wordpress.com/
AtlasHeating
Senior Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 356




Ignore
« Reply #2 on: March 18, 2008, 05:52:06 PM »

I have used them and they are great strings. They last and sound good as advertised. Eventually the string will wear through the winding and physically wear out. I had a set on my L-03 for about a year until the G string wore through at the 2nd fret. My biggest problem is no medium gauges.
Logged
Braxton
Senior Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 285


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #3 on: March 18, 2008, 07:30:12 PM »

Well, I could not afford a titanium bike, maybe I'll go for the strings......
Logged

Sandro

Recording King RNJ-25 (2011)
Bruno Barnes Italian Spruce & Maple (2010)
Martin OM-21 Special (2006)
Classic Di Giorgio Student 18 (1975)    

I love the smell of Italian Spruce in the morning
Michael T
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1477


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #4 on: March 18, 2008, 11:51:09 PM »

Got my attention! May be a candidate for my Taylor T5C2-koa 12 string. I have been using acoustic 10-50 Thomastik which are fine but Taylor recommends electric strings for the alloy content and it's response for the magnetic pick up. I don't care for the tone or the feel of the electric string sets at all. Maybe the titanium content would produce the benefit of the alloy response with the acoustic tone? For those who have used them, how do they compare to a good acoustic string tonally?
Logged

08 Larrivee L05-12
02 Larrivee DV-09
73 Granada Custom
Kids got the others  :)

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=797065

brandon
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1295




Ignore
« Reply #5 on: March 19, 2008, 02:06:30 AM »

too rich for my blood. website looks kinda retro though
Logged

in His grasp,
brandon

D-60 (rosie)
OMV-50
O-60
AtlasHeating
Senior Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 356




Ignore
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2008, 10:36:20 PM »

I liked the sound tone, I really liked the fact that they sounded pure for a long time.
Logged
Michael T
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1477


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2008, 12:24:10 AM »

I got an e-mail back from them, they don't make a 12 string set, and the pickup systems won't "see" titanium, big bucks too. 3 strikes, they're out. Oh well  ohmy
Logged

08 Larrivee L05-12
02 Larrivee DV-09
73 Granada Custom
Kids got the others  :)

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=797065

Dale_I
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1209




Ignore
« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2008, 04:30:17 AM »

My biggest problem is no medium gauges.

All I found listed on their site was Medium sets. Both in Nickel and Phosphor Bronze with and without low tension.

For the titanium not working with pickups, the only pickups that would be affected would be magnetic pick ups (humbucker or single coil styles). Any under saddle, under bridge, or mic system should work just fine.

If your stings are wearing out fast, corrosion or not, I'd say these might be good to try. I've been using Newtone's, but I do have an acidic nature and my strings feel the punishment. I'll give them a try. I'm always up for something new. Someone has to see if they are lying....
Logged

"The barrier to knowledge is the belief that you have it"

2006 Larrivee LV-10 MR   1980 Les Paul Custom Natural   Larrivee LV-03-12   1998 Carvin LB75 Koa Bass
AtlasHeating
Senior Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 356




Ignore
« Reply #9 on: March 25, 2008, 02:37:10 PM »

Their Medium is really light. Kind of like DR strings.
Logged
Dale_I
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1209




Ignore
« Reply #10 on: March 25, 2008, 05:27:46 PM »

I just looked at D'Addario, Cleartone, Newtone, CF Martin, DR, Elixer, and compared them to the Rohrtech. Although I would put the Rohrtech on the lighter side of the medium gauges (by .001), I couldn't classify them as lights. I currently have Newtone Med-Lights and they are definitely heavier than the mid grade between light and medium, but are only .001 off on what most companies call their mediums.

A secondary thought was this, if they truly provide a lower tension for the same pitch, you really don't want the mass increasing too much. You would likely end up with string slap forcing you to raise the action. More dangerous when moving to lesser mass strings is the affect on sustain. However, the Rohrtech sets do have a larger diameter low end compared to the Newtone Med-Lights I'm currently strung with. So, I'll hope I would gain and not lose sustain. We'll see....
Logged

"The barrier to knowledge is the belief that you have it"

2006 Larrivee LV-10 MR   1980 Les Paul Custom Natural   Larrivee LV-03-12   1998 Carvin LB75 Koa Bass
AtlasHeating
Senior Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 356




Ignore
« Reply #11 on: March 25, 2008, 08:47:47 PM »

When you compare the tension, they are lights. Because they are using different materials the strings will be a bit thicker but the tension is light gauge. That being said, they did not work well for my Martin Dread, but did work well for the Larrivee L-03.
Logged
Dale_I
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1209




Ignore
« Reply #12 on: March 25, 2008, 11:16:04 PM »

When you compare the tension, they are lights. Because they are using different materials the strings will be a bit thicker but the tension is light gauge. That being said, they did not work well for my Martin Dread, but did work well for the Larrivee L-03.

I guess I'm missing your point. The whole purpose of using the different materials is to lower the string tension, which would allow for easier fretting and better playability, without reducing size. Keeping the similar size should retain volume and sustain and lowering the tension would make it better to play.

Because of the material, titanium and nickel, they admit to having a longer "bright" period during break in. Once broken in, their claim anyway, is to have an extremely long usable period where the string does not reach "the dead zone". The materials should give a larger advantage to those who are forced to change strings a lot due to body chemistry, but I can't see that as a disadvantage to those that don't have a higher acidity issue either.
Logged

"The barrier to knowledge is the belief that you have it"

2006 Larrivee LV-10 MR   1980 Les Paul Custom Natural   Larrivee LV-03-12   1998 Carvin LB75 Koa Bass
Dale_I
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1209




Ignore
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2008, 05:47:05 AM »

Part of my "real job" I design air flow characteristics for turbo diesel engines. I read the diesel performance forums with one eye closed because most of the opinions are stated as fact with very little physics or understanding of such needed. Repeated enough, others start stating them as facts and they take on a life of their own. All to say, I tend to try to provide actual facts when available to hopefully stop the insanity of opinion, and requiring fact from others when able.

However, transferring that to my passion of guitar is not all that successful. Largely because guitar is a function of the senses. What you like to hear, what you like to feel when playing, and any matter of the senses are largely a matter of individual opinion. As well, what works for one, may not work for another. Given the subjective nature, any variety of opposing facts, let alone opinion, can coexist at any given time with equal validity.

I only bring this up for an intro to an apology to AtlasHeating. Rereading my last posts it seems (to me) that I am opposing your statements. I heartfully apologize. I am not invalidating your experiences and I hope I didn't offend you.

That said, here is what I got back from Newtone. "...our Master Class .012-.052 are 157lbs compared to our Heritage .012-.051 are 131lbs...", Neal Silverman

The Master Class .012-.052 are the Med-Light set I currently use. The Heritage set is their "low tension" strings specifically designed for vintage instruments. I was going to use these as a base line, along with some other generally used strings I read about on this forum, for a comparison. So, here is some info on string thickness and tension that I was able to collect.

Company defined Medium string sets:
Rohrtech titanium/nickel: .012 .016 .026 .034 .044 .055
Newtone Master Class:    .013 .017 .026 .036 .046 .056
D'Addario Ph/Br:            .013 .017 .026 .035 .045 .056
Elixir :                           .013 .017 .026 .035 .045 .056
Cleartone:                     .012 .016 .025 .033 .043 .053

Company defined Med-Light sets:
Newtone Master Class:    .012 .016 .024 .032 .042 .052

Company defined Light string sets:
Newtone Master Class:   .011 .012 .018 .026 .036 .046
D'Addario Ph/Br: .          012 .016 .024 .032 .042 .053
Elixir:                           .012 .016 .024 .032 .042 .053
Cleartone:                    .011 .015 .024 .032 .042 .052

Company defined low tension sets:
Rohrtech titanium/nickel:  .0145 .0155 .024 .032 .042 .0525
Newtone Heritage:          .012   .016   .020 .028 .038 .051

Cumulative tension rates:
Newtone Heritage:        131 lbs
Rohrtech Low Tension:  147 lbs
Newtone MC Med-Light: 157 lbs
Rohrtech Medium:         160 lbs
D'Addario Ph/Br Light:    163 lbs
D'Addario Ph/Br Medium: 189 lbs

I didn't include stings I couldn't get tension rates on except for the Elixir since I see so many posts with people using their stings and Cleartone since that is what comes on a stock Larrivee. So, what do I take away from all this?

Rohrtech Mediums appear to be more of a medium or medium light, but not a light. Even the sting tension is not out of the range for what you would find in Phosphor Bronze Mediums, although on the light side. It also appears that the Newtone Master Class Med-Lights are more of a light when compared to the diameter of most other manufacturer's sets.

It appears that the claims of Newtone having lower string tension due to the use of round cores it true. However, it also appears the Rohrtech has an advantage over round cores in string tension rates. Since the Rohrtech "low tension" set is almost exactly the same diameter as the Newtone Med-Lights and they came across with 10 lbs lower total string tension. Rohrtech Mediums, which are far more "medium" than the previously mentioned Newtone M/C Med-Lights (which should be Lights), are only 3lbs more in accumulated tension.

So, titanium or round core seems to have an advantage in string tension for the same diameter size over conventional strings with a slight nod to the titanium. If the titanium hold a longer usable life, they may be better deal. However, they would have to last as long as the percentage they are more expensive because I could purchase 2 sets of Newtones for the price of 1 set of Titanium Nickel. Will they last twice as long???

NEW THING I LEARNED:  Wound strings have the opportunity to unravel, leaving the sting "dead".  The ductile coatings used in the manufacture process yield over time to corrosion and deterioration of the coating due to vibration. Eliminating these will lead to a longer lasting string that will not go "dead" as quickly. Probably why an acidic nature will deaden stings and also why coated stings go from live to dead very quickly.

NEW THING TO THINK ABOUT: I was reading where progressive sting tension, where the sting tension almost stays the same between strings, makes the guitar play "better". You actually want the tension on the lower noted string to progress ever so slightly. It makes sense once you consider thickness, diameter, and vibration. I just never thought about it. Rohrtech is the only company with a progressive tension string package, albeit their low E does not follow this pattern. By The Way: I didn't read about progressive string tension on the Rohrtech site, it just happens that I noticed their tension charts followed the theory.
Logged

"The barrier to knowledge is the belief that you have it"

2006 Larrivee LV-10 MR   1980 Les Paul Custom Natural   Larrivee LV-03-12   1998 Carvin LB75 Koa Bass
Dale_I
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1209




Ignore
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2008, 05:37:25 PM »

Just recieved an email back from Rohrtech. They confirmed that since the Titanium Nickel has a low magnetic signature, especially the G string which is also low in mass, does not work well with magnetic style pick ups. For acoustic players, that would mean a pickup like the LR Baggs M1 would not work.

However, the under saddle or under bridge like the LRB Element, LRB iBeam, LRB iMix, or mic would all work fine. I called LR Baggs just to make sure, and they confirmed. They said they even use the non-magnetic pick ups in classical nylon stinged guitars with no problem.  My orders is going in, I'll let you know what I think after playing on them for a while.
Logged

"The barrier to knowledge is the belief that you have it"

2006 Larrivee LV-10 MR   1980 Les Paul Custom Natural   Larrivee LV-03-12   1998 Carvin LB75 Koa Bass
AtlasHeating
Senior Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 356




Ignore
« Reply #15 on: March 27, 2008, 02:00:50 PM »

Dale,
 when you posted the total tension of different sets, the D'Addario medium gauge (189)was well above the Newtone (157)or the Rhortech (160). All I am saying is they do not have anything with 189 pounds of tension. Less tension = less sound on my Martin. They worked great on my L-03.
I really hope you like the strings.
Logged
edgeguy
Senior Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 124




Ignore
« Reply #16 on: March 27, 2008, 02:19:11 PM »

Thanks for all the responses.  It was much more informative than I had hoped for.  Can't wait to see some detailed reviews on the strings. 
Logged

Larrivee OM-03 MQ
Dale_I
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1209




Ignore
« Reply #17 on: March 27, 2008, 07:23:14 PM »

...when you posted the total tension of different sets, the D'Addario medium gauge (189)was well above the Newtone (157)or the Rhortech (160). All I am saying is they do not have anything with 189 pounds of tension. Less tension = less sound on my Martin.

I think I might be confused again. If you are stating the D'Addario does not make a string with 189 lbs of tension, I got the tension figures from their own site. The D'Addario Phosphor Bronze Medium set is listed with these tensions:
27.4, 26.3, 35.3, 36.8, 34, and 29, which add to 188.8 lbs of accumulated tension.
http://www.daddario.com/DADProdDetail.aspx?CodaID=584&ID=2&Class=ABPA

In fact, more surprising to me, because I expected the medium sets to be higher in tension than the similar round core or titanium, is that even the light set of D'Addario was a higher tension than the medium set of Rohrtech.

The point of round core strings and/or titanium core strings IS to reduce tension. They should be less than a normally constructed string value for the same thickness. The equation of less tension equaling less sound on the Martin can't really be made absolutely. There is so much more than tension that creates volume in a guitar. Mass, density, frequency, winding process, winding material, wound tightness, etc. In fact, this is easily experienced in the fact of dead strings. Same materials, same mass, same tension, same sting, yet they lose volume and brightness. After reading about string theory, I would guess it has to do with the winding tension and how vibration and corrosion break down and deteriorate the strings ability to obtain a beneficial frequency.

But, that is the whole purpose of trying different materials and construction processes. Aside from the obvious longevity issue with corrosion.

But, please, don't shoot the messenger. As I said before, I am not hear to offend you or your experiences. I just posted the factual information I found. There are plenty of times that the reality of facts don't appear to have anything to do with personal subjective experiences.

Who knows? I may not like the way they feel and just go back to something I enjoy more...
Logged

"The barrier to knowledge is the belief that you have it"

2006 Larrivee LV-10 MR   1980 Les Paul Custom Natural   Larrivee LV-03-12   1998 Carvin LB75 Koa Bass
saffron_boots
Guest

« Reply #18 on: March 27, 2008, 07:54:01 PM »

The whole purpose of using the different materials is to lower the string tension, which would allow for easier fretting and better playability, without reducing size. Keeping the similar size should retain volume and sustain and lowering the tension would make it better to play.

There is so much more than tension that creates volume in a guitar. Mass, density, frequency, winding process, winding material, wound tightness, etc.

Is this correct? What does the size have to do with volume and sustain? I always saw those as attributes of the tension the strings place on the soundboard; and that string size was related, mechanically, to the desired root note and tension.

The second quoted paragraph would seem to hold true for ELECTRIC guitars and the interaction with magnetic pickups.
Logged
AtlasHeating
Senior Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 356




Ignore
« Reply #19 on: March 27, 2008, 08:15:20 PM »

I find this all interesting. I will state myself once again. I use medium gauge strings on my Martin HD-28. For THIS guitar, I prefer medium gauge strings like D'Addario EJ -17 .013 -.056. The Rhortech strings are really Light gauge strings according to the total tension (DR also calls light gauge medium). My experience has confirmed this. I really like the strings even though they are a bit pricey they are good. I can not use them on the Martin they won't drive the top.
Logged
Pages: [1] 2   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to: