Smaller bodied guitars

[Denis]

Seems to me, when I started playing 25 years ago, when I went to music stores, all that they carried were dreads, dreads and more dreads.  There may have been the odd jumbo or 000/OM but in general smaller guitars were nowhere to be seen.  Now, in 2006, all the major makers have a parlor or two in their catalog along with a selection of 0's , 00's, 000's and OM's.  Twelve fret slotted pegheads are all the rage. 

I know that I love the fact that these "little" guitars are out there.  When I started, I wanted and got a Martin D-28.  As time went by, I started realizing that for me, fingerstyle just didn't sound right on the D-28.  I know many forum members own these smaller guitars.  I myself will take possession of a 2004 satin rosewood parlor next week.  I couldn't be happier. 

Is the small body guitar popularity due to changing styles?  Tastes?  Is it the fact that you can make them with less wood?

[unclrob]

Just changing markets.I seem to profer Jumbo's myself.

[fitness1]

I guess the root of Denis' question is why are the markets changing........interesting thought too.   I know for me, when I bought my first acoustic in '76, I wanted something powerful......if I wasn't gonna plug that sucker into my Marshall, it better howl on it's own - LOL.    As I have aged, and become a better player, fingerstyle playing has nearly taken over my repertoire......the more responsive, articulate smaller bodied instruments are much more pleasing to my ear.  The Huss and Dalton CM I got yesterday is almost too big....it's kind of between a GA or L and a Dread.     I find with the smaller bodies, the notes jump out quicker and dont' get lost inside the big chasm......and with all the great builders out there now, they are finding way to make those smaller instruments almost as loud as the dreads.   On the other side of the coin, OM's and Grand Concerts are as small as I will go, Parlors just aren't enough for me because I capo up and play up the neck a lot and they tend to get pretty thin as a general rule (other than my 1897 Washburn, I haven't played or owned a great parlor)  So I guess, in the end, it's just a bunch of baby boomers who have the discretionary income that, like me, are fine tuning their playing and ears, and driving the market.

[rpg51]

I could be wrong - but I think the smaller bodies came first - then the dreads?? Is that not the case? 

[stubby]

I guess I fit the definition of "baby boomer with discretionary income", but I'll tell you why I bought a small guitar (larrivee parlour). I've owned a Guild dreadnaught (d-40c) for over 20 years, and all of my guitars before that were dreads as well. Having smallish fingers (hence the monicker stubby), I've always found that the dreads (or any 25 1/2 scale) were a real workout, and an amost impossible stretch for some chords. I decided a while ago that my life mate would really need a shorter neck scale, and I got a Norman B20 folk guitar (which has a scale of 24.8, I believe. Big difference, a lot easier to play, but the Norman felt more like a passing fling than a life mate. When I learned about the parlor's 24 inch scale, I couldn't resist. While the neck scale is perfect for me, the unintended bonus is the body size. It just feels like more of a fit for me than a dread, which I always found awkward. Further bonus: the parlor is forcing me to alter my playing style (I'm leaving chick a boom for more nuanced, muffled playing, and much more fingerpicking. That can't be a bad thing, can it?

[Denis]

I could be wrong - but I think the smaller bodies came first - then the dreads?? Is that not the case? 

Until Martin came out with the dreads back in the 30's, the biggest guitars available were Martin 000 with 12 fret necks and slotted headstocks so yes, the smaller guitars came first.  But the smaller guitars fell out of favor many many years ago and have made a comeback in the past, I say, 10 years maybe.

[Thinman]

I switched from a Dread for health reasons. The huge bout was pinching a nerve on the underside of my right arm.
It was a question of getting a Laskin guitar with that genius of a bevel armwrest  for ten grand or so or get something smaller.
I love my OM. Very huggable on the couch.

[Steve]

"I could be wrong - but I think the smaller bodies came first - then the dreads?? Is that not the case?"

Yep, dreadnoughts as we know most of the modern design with 14 frets clear did not show up until Martin produced them in 1934.  The very first Dreadnoughts were 12 fret clear and these were first produce in 1916, built by Martin for the Oliver Ditson Co.

Small body guitars similiar to the parlor with 5 and 6 courses started showing up in the 17th century, these had upper and lower bouts of almost the same size.  Later a more moder 6 string parlor type guitar with larger lower bout started showing up in the later part of the 19th century.

The history of the Dreadnought guitar can be view at the Martin Guitar site. 
http://www.martinguitar.com/history/dreadnought.php

Some interesting history on Parlor guitars that I put together can be view here.
http://steve.ps8318.com/ParlorGuitars/

More interesting information on OM size guitars can be found in a great article at the Acoustic Player Magazine.
http://www.acousticplayermagazine.com/apm002/techtalk002/johnston_OM_002/johnston_OM_1_002.html

[Ratishna]

The real change in the market during the folk boom of the early 1960s.  Most folk musicians were playing large body guitars, and when demand rose (and it rose quickly) the market responded with the most commonly used guitar of that time and musical style which was the dreadnaught.  During the rock music boom that followed, the Japanese got involved and produced mainly dreads for the market.  It became the shape associated with the acoustic guitar.  Except for Joan Baez, it seems everybody played the big guitars.  Stills had a few 00 and 000 Martins but they were mainly for around the house.  The dread was 'the' acoustic until sometime in the early 1990s and the rise of handbuilts coupled with the renewed interest in acoustics in general.

E. Shoaf

[Bruce Chiriani]

Before electronic amplification existed, guitar manufacturers were willing to give up some sweet tone, balance and articulation in favor of the volume needed to compete in band settings. Now that guitars can be miked or fitted with good pick-up systems, there is no longer a need to play a large guitar to be heard. Moreover, in my opinion, a well built OM (like my OM10K) can hold its own against most run-of-the-mill, mass-produced dreadnoughts these days, especially in the mid and high registers. Just my $.02...

[jimmyd]

Erc Schoenberg was a big influence in getting Martin to put an effort into reintroducing the OM size instrument. That segment of the market seems to keep growing. I believe Dana Bourgeois was also involved. It makes sense to develop styles of instruments that are well suited to fingerstyle players. I'm wondering if we are near a tipping point where flatpickers are becomming outnumbered by fingerstyle players. It sure seems that in custom and high end instruments that flat pickers are a minority. Guess the motto might be
"Martin dread until I'm dead!"

[el guitana]

I have a 00 sized 12 fret slothead made in Korea, solid top and back. I really enjoy playing fingerstyle on it.

But I've always been into dreads (except for a small period with an Ovation). I guess it's because that's what was out there.

But my take on the resurging popularity of small bodies is that it is fueled by the INTERNET. We read forums and manufacturers web sites. After the growth of the internet,  many have us have become half educated in guitar types and models and specs while sitting in front of our computers. As a result, we want new and different things.

I'll bet there are many here who, before turning on to internet guitar sites, never really gave much thought to nut width and saddle materials and string spacing and the whole "solid/laminate/rosewood/mahogany/you name it" thing.

Are we playing better?

[Peter Cree]

Ain't the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog.

[fitness1]

Ain't the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog.

ahh, now there's an interesting thought.....I agree completely....and as our eternally wise Unclrob once put it....."if it ain't loud enough for ya, stick a mic in front of it!!"

[Peter Cree]

I've got an O body that'll compete with any dread.  Alot more to a guitar than size.  I heard alot of pretty quiet and underpowered dreads and jumbos.

[Denis]

I've got an O body that'll compete with any dread.  Alot more to a guitar than size.  I heard alot of pretty quiet and underpowered dreads and jumbos.

Which one is that Peter?

[desaljs]

Good topic.  I am starting to explore smaller bodied instruments, and shorter scale length.  Fit me into the the baby boomer getting older, with some disposable income bracket!  My first real venture into smaller bodied guitars came courtesy of Santa Cruz, and a wonderful short scale OM.  It sounds like a well balanced dread, and has plenty of bass response.  Next up will be an OO 12-fret slot head Cruz (cedar over rosewood).  The narrower waist of these instruments makes them seem to sit nice, and no big reach over like the dreads require.

I still will always have a nice dread to play however, as nothing seems to be quite the same.  It's all good fun.  But am slowly going with all shorter scale, 1 3/4 inch nut width set-ups.

[Walkerman]

How do the sizes go?  I know parlor is the smallest, and I suppose that jumbo is the largest, but how do the sizes go inbetween?  I am looking for something to play while relaxing on my couch, and the dreads and L bodies are just too large.  This is more for sitting back and playing by  myself, and not for playing along with other folks.  But, I would like it to be loud enough in case someone walks in wanting to play.  I do  some rudimentary fingerstyle, but mostly flatpicking.  I guess as time goes on, it makes more sense to do more fingerstyle.

[Randy_R]

How do the sizes go?  I know parlor is the smallest, and I suppose that jumbo is the largest, but how do the sizes go inbetween?  I am looking for something to play while relaxing on my couch, and the dreads and L bodies are just too large.  This is more for sitting back and playing by  myself, and not for playing along with other folks.  But, I would like it to be loud enough in case someone walks in wanting to play.  I do  some rudimentary fingerstyle, but mostly flatpicking.  I guess as time goes on, it makes more sense to do more fingerstyle.

http://randyrick.us/guitars/LarriveeSpecs.htm

cheers