What elevates the boutique guitars? A "vicarious" thread.

[Peter Cree]

Actually it's not.............. :rolleyes:

JOKING.    Rob U R great.    4000 more!

[Gemnoc]

if you want some more info on this topic i suggest doing a search on the AGF forum. This topic got a lot of response over there custom v's production guitars, especially with the rising popularity of a custom builder called trevor Kronbauer, apparently he builds boutique guitars at production guitar prices.

I just visited Kronbauer's website. He does have very low prices. And judging from the gallery he seems to do nice work.

[ronmac]

If you want value in a hand made guitar, from a very low volume builder (and ex-Larrivee Custom Shop Luthier) you should have a look at Heath Hales' guitars (Thomsley brand).

http://www.thomsleyguitars.com/base.htm

I purchased an OM cutaway sitka/rw recently from Heath that is absolutely killer. It is one of 2 guitars that I keep out of the case so that I can grab them when the mood strikes. Pictures are here: http://photobucket.com/albums/v631/ronmac/Guitars/Thomsley/

[Gemnoc]

ronmac, I remember your Thomsley. Nice! And he's still cheaper than Kronbauer.

An OM is probably my next purchase. If I was listening to myself I would have blown my vacation budget (planning to go to Spain this spring) and bought one already. But my playing simply can't justify a second quality guitar. Yet. :rolleyes:

[Fergy07]

I'm with a few of the other people who have posted on this one...I tend to like the guitars in the $1500 to $3k range. Much more than that and I feel it gets to be an extravagance, much less than that and I tend to be unhappy with something on the guitar. The best so far for me has been my experience with the custom Webber. It was in the right price range, had all the features that I wanted on it (not prechosen by someone else), and is just a joy to play. Depending on my bonus in a month or two, I may go for a custom 00 in walnut/Engleman. Then again, my wife might say no.

Andy

[bluestrain]

Well, I have played a Froggy Bottom in the shop, and I have to say, it is entirely different from playing any larger company guitar that I have played.  There is a strength to the tone, a fullness to each note, yet spearated, it sounds like really smooth rich wood, very natrual, but very very impressive.  I had a similar experience playing a Santa Cruz and a Collings.  All just stunning. 

The important difference I think is that a luthier hand tunes the top...joinery, specific wood selection/matching, braces shaving, are all also factors in the sound of a guitar. I only know any of this from having read Guitar: An American Life, by Tim Brookes. A great read, and very informative.  I'd say try one for yourself and see if I am bs-ing.   For me, I plan to wait tuntil I am a better player and until I am rich, then I will take the plunge.

[Guitar Jim]

All the instruments, except for one, I've bought over the past 8 years have been handmade by an individual luthier. I've bought guitars, dulcimers and a Weissenborn style lapsteel. All have been relatively inexpensive compared to the ridiculous prices of some so called boutique manufacturers. There's many fine luthiers worldwide plying their trade who are not famous and who do not charge the earth.
The main advantage to buying direct from the builder is you can negotiate the design features, in other words get the *precise* woods, materials, specs and setup you desire. When anyone buys an  already made guitar, whether it costs $500 or $5,000, you are invariably faced with compromise.
Once an instrument is of a certain standard, and that standard varies depending on the player, then it *really is* the player and not the guitar.

[whiskeyjack]

This is a great thread.  Lots of folks with more experience than I'll ever have commenting on something akin to every guitar-players dream of having the holy grail built. And it's hard to make a short, trite comment that gets a point across.  Especially if you're verbally challenged. ^_^

I don't know if the distinction was made between "boutique guitars" and "custom guitars."  I guess they could be the same animal.  But I see where a Ryan or a Wingert guitar, for example, could be considered a boutique instrument without being custom made for a specific individual.  They are special by virtue of the reputation of the luthier and craftsmanship.  That, in itself, elevates them to boutique status whether or not the buyer had anything to do with selecting the materials or features.  I haven't played enough of 'em to really know if the benefits are worth the cost.  For me they would not be.

"Custom Guitars" on the other hand, carry the distinction of hand-selected features personally chosen by the buyer.  That is what MIGHT elevate them to boutique status.  Where a non-custom Wingert or Petros guitar might spend a week on ebay,  a Paragon custom might hang around for a month if it gets sold at all. The custom guitar is a very personal and very novel instrument built for any number of reasons for a specific individual.  It would seem, the buyer needs to be prepared to keep a guitar like that since, to sell it for what it's worth, is also the cost of having a new one built to one's own specs.  Now THERE's a diminishing return. . . .

But when the dust settles at the end of the day, it's the instrument's voice and its playability that I really pay for.  If those things don't fit together, the most expensive Olson or Ryan is useless to me. 

For myself, it's taken me a while to recognize that big money doesn't necessarily mean better sound or playability.  And it took Bob Taylor's brilliant PR move to listen more closely to his guitars and to recognize that pretty, expensive guitars don't all sound pretty.  I'm a lot easier to please these days.  And it's cheaper.

edit:
oh.  it sure is nice to be able to delete stupid statements.

[lestrouble]

nice cutaway.......

[fitness1]

case in point regarding my comment about the builder being accesible with questions and concerns.   I had emailed back and for the Tim Nelson (sales manager at Huss and Dalton) yesterd and this morning.  I had a question regarding removal of the tortois pickguard they installed in my CM at the factory.   He said to call and he would talk to me about it.  I called the number in his email signature and Jeff Huss answered.....I was a bit suprised, but it was pretty cool to talk to him.   We chatted for a couple of minutes about the instrumenta and my impressions.   Seemed like a really nice guy.

[jimmyd]

case in point regarding my comment about the builder being accesible with questions and concerns.   I had emailed back and for the Tim Nelson (sales manager at Huss and Dalton) yesterd and this morning.  I had a question regarding removal of the tortois pickguard they installed in my CM at the factory.   He said to call and he would talk to me about it.  I called the number in his email signature and Jeff Huss answered.....I was a bit suprised, but it was pretty cool to talk to him.   We chatted for a couple of minutes about the instrumenta and my impressions.   Seemed like a really nice guy.

He is a very nice guy and they are all intensly interested in what people think of their instruments. Every one on their staff I've met are great people. If you walked in there you would not know if Jeff huss or Mark Dalton were the owners, employees or just a guy hanging out, except that they are all usually  pretty busy. If you are ever in the area you owe it to yourself to take a tour and meet them.

[Ratishna]

If you are anywhere near the northeast this summer, get yourself over to Newport RI for the guitar show in August.  It will have about 75 luthiers displaying their wares and provides the best possible environment for convincing one's self that a hand made guitar is worth the price.  If you're a left-coaster there's Healdsburg in 2007.

E. Shoaf

[UK Mike]

I had a custom guitar built - some of the things that separated out that experience from buying a factory guitar were:

• There is a lot more choice in shapes/sizes once you leave the factory catalogues



• There is a lot more choice in woods once you leave the factory catalogues



• There is a lot more choice in detailing (tuners, purfling, rosettes etc) once you leave the factory catalogues



• I could visit the builder, talk through the wood choice, have him demonstrate the tap-tones and then pick particular wood sets based on tone and appearance



• You can have exactly the neck profile you want on a custom guitar



• The small shop/custom builder will normally put a lot more hours into each guitar (though I appreciate the law of diminishing returns mentioned above)



• Bracing can be hand-tuned to each guitar rather than fixing in CNC braces (tis may be th emost significant advantage of having the extra hours)



• Exellent support is expected rather than being a "delighter"

All the above added up to a unique guitar, made for me, to superb standards. That is not to say that there aren't excellent guitars coming out of factories but having a guitar made for you by an experienced luthier is a very different experience from buying a factory guitar. I have a luthier guitar (Dave King), a small shop non-custom guitar (Lowden) and two factory guitars (Larrivee) and I enjoy them all but they each have a different feel to them. They are also at three different price points which must be taken into consideration as well.

I'm glad we have all the excellent choices available to us today.

Cheers

Mike

[HangFire]

Very well put UK Mike, I think you summed it up very nicely! :WNK>

[pigtown]

I was in Maryland last weekend visiting some friends for a picking party, and part of Saturday was spent at a small shop that specializes in "boutique" guitars.  It was really something to sit there and be handed one after another of these $3,000+ guitars to play.  Ryan to Beneteau to Mayes, Kinscherff, Flammang, Osthoff, Oriskany, those are just the ones I remember.  There is a difference up in that range from the typical production guitars.  But by typical production I'm including the range below that.  Compared to many of those, even brands like Collings and Santa Cruz are almost "production" when there is one man building one guitar like a John Osthoff in Massachusetts.  My favorite was a relatively unkown, although I've seen his name on the 'net, Kwasnycia.  It was a small jumbo, felt and sounded really nice. But like many of us here, I'd be looking for a place to live and selling the guitar for rent if I brought one home!  Here's the shop, Fine Acoustics in Westminster, MD:

http://www.fineacoustics.com/products.asp

[fitness1]

Saturday was spent at a small shop that specializes in "boutique" guitars.  It was really something to sit there and be handed one after another of these $3,000+ guitars to play.    My favorite was a relatively unkown, although I've seen his name on the 'net, Kwasnycia. 

the Kwasnycia is a beautiful instrument....you can tell he knows who Mr Olson is - LOL    It a darn good thing I don't live near a shop like that......

[pigtown]

the Kwasnycia is a beautiful instrument....you can tell he knows who Mr Olson is - LOL    It a darn good thing I don't live near a shop like that......

You've been reading my mail...that's exactly what I said to the shop owner.  Closest thing to an Olson I've seen.