Saddle for 1st Larrivee, an OM

[LoMa]

I have a short scale Larrivee 00-03R - 24-3/4" long - and my guitar tech said the intonation on the low was slightly off and so compensated the saddle for the low E string. In short scale guitars, you are more likely to find minor intonation problems like that, apparently.

Anyway, if your intonation is fine, no need to compensate for the low E string. If it's slightly off, then go for it.

Mind, you I could not hear the slightly off intonation, but it could be measured and someone with more sensitive pitch might hear it. I would not have bothered with compensating for the low E string, but it was included in the set-up my tech did at not extra charge...

[headsup]

Compensated saddles are the most important and best thing to ever happen to acoustic guitars.
When I was working at Rufus guitar shop in Montreal, (before Chuck Baker bought it and moved it west) we used to carve and shape each bone saddle in direct accordance to a stobe scope.

I believe we were the first people to do this (early seventies) even JCL wasn't doing compensated saddles at the time, and it took a while to talk him into it.

It's a pretty simple scenario, if your guitar hasn't had its saddle properly intonated, the guitar will be out of tune as you progress up the neck.
frets that aren't crowned properly will have the same effect.
so will will older strings (they go flat when dead).

If you want to record, play with others, or be in tune when moving into 2nd, 3rd or 4th positions (or using a capo).
Compensated saddles are a must.

The factory compensation, like set up, is general and a real carved/shaped saddle made by a technician is about the best thing you can do for your guitar.

just my 2  cents.

[Duque]

  Really good to read several opinions about this, I'm a believer in compenasted saddles too, but after reading a lot of opinions and googled for quite a while:

1.- I'm intrigued really!, I got to say, several members vote for a non compensated, and say their guitars sound nice and even across the fingerboard! there's got to be a reason! and I believe them when they say so...

2.- The mention of a non-compensated placed in the guitar slot working just as fine "because the already slanted saddle position" so it works as a compensation already! except for the B string which is set back...

3.- As Unclrob mentioned, he placed a plain piece of bone, with no compensation at all, not even for the B string as I understood...and he's made several saddles like this with perfect results,

I confess, I'm really interested in trying a plain piece of bone like this, and with no pre-ideas that I may already have, give it a fair shot...and see...

After reading lots of opinions, and conversations about how a fully compensated is a must... I'm totally eager to try a plain saddle, and see if the SLANT that is already present from factory is ALL THAT'S NEEDED! 

PS. unclrob guys, if you don't have a b string compensated, do you fine tune it flat a bit? ar at all?

[unclrob]

I tune normal.I also fine that I'm at most 2-3 cents either way depending on the guitar.My own guitars are all set up with non-compensated saddle's and play past the 12 fret with no issue.I have many players that want the intonation spot on {I do make compensated saddle's when ask too} and then complain that the intonation is out when the play and I have to remind them that when the press too hard that there pulling the string sharp,also as they get more excited or strum harder the press down harder again pulling the strings sharp.I also don't like pre-made compensated saddle's due to no two guitars being the same.This means that when compensating a saddle it should be done for that guitar.Even with the pre-fab saddle's the B can be off.

[headsup]

I concur with uncrob on the fact that every guitar is different.
there are many factors, (not just the saddle that will pre determine intonation.
A player who prefers high action (like myself) will have different intonation issues than a person who prefers a lower action.

interesting to note as well, most classical guitars (until very recently) didn't have intonated saddles.

There was a brief time when Gibson had metal tuno-matic type bridges on their acoustic guitars, set in metal posts, which was just HORRID!

to each his own I guess.....

[nolifebutbmx]

i think another interesting thing to consider is slightly flat intonation on any or all strings sounds waaay better than slighty sharp.
To my ear anyways.
I feel like when the note is under, its still trying to reach the desired tone, still able to fully resolve. when the note is sharp and has gone past its destination, it's like it fell off the proverbial tuning cliff or something  : )

[Danny]

I concur with uncrob on the fact that every guitar is different.
there are many factors, (not just the saddle that will pre determine intonation.
A player who prefers high action (like myself) will have different intonation issues than a person who prefers a lower action.

interesting to note as well, most classical guitars (until very recently) didn't have intonated saddles.

There was a brief time when Gibson had metal tuno-matic type bridges on their acoustic guitars, set in metal posts, which was just HORRID!

to each his own I guess.....

That horrible adjustable bridge on Gibsons ruined the value of many otherwise great vintage Gibsons. They even put a cheap plastic bridge on some models in the 60's. That was also HORRID!

[Duque]

I totally agree, they looked terrible   I totally agree too as the preference to have slightly flat notes instead of going sharp, no doubt,

I confess being intrigued by these comments, I've never put a plain (totally plain) saddle on my Larri OM05, I have a bone piece at home, which is solid and nicely rounded for the strings to make contact...I think I'll try it, the same at 3/32s on the Low E at 12th fret, and see the results, will play several chords, tunes, jazzy chords, up down the neck, everything, and see the results...i'm quite curious right now to be honest...

So far what I've tried has been the regular Larrivee saddle, and a graphtech fully compensated, this will be interesting for me,

I only wish I had spare new strings 'cause every time you lossen or tighten the strings, besides ruining their sound...they break!

[unclrob]

I've seen more and more classical guitars coming in with the "G" string compensated.The saddle is still straight.Also maybe I don't have a problem due to the fact that I'm a tele player and prefer the original style three saddle,that by the way aren't tilted for intonation.My newist addition is a set neck tele that has a hardtail strat style bridge with six saddle's and as soon as I can get to a bandsaw I'll be cutting down a tele bridge with the three saddle's so I can fit it to the guitar.

[Zohn]

  Hi Duque
Thanx for the donuts and welcome, oh and congratulations with that OM-05

[Duque]

Good comments, and Zohn thanks for the welcome!

I have not played the other guitars since getting the OM05, it's incredible the balance Larrivee gets, no other guitar I own vibrates like this, hey! My Collings OM1 engelmann, costed twice the Larrivee, and got to admit, both are up there sound wise!

Will try in a while the plain saddle I shaped yesterday for the Larrivee....can't wait

[unclrob]

Make sure that as much string as possible come's in contact with the saddle.

[Duque]

Thanks unclrob, I will, I tried last night to give it a nice angle, rounding the contact point, If needed I'll sand a bit more, evenly across the six strings

I'm just afraid that the bone saddle is a hair thiner than the original saddle, looks almost the same, once I remove the original I'll know if it fits snugly on the slot...

If it doesn't, a luthier once told me a provisional remedy, is to smear one side of the saddle with a thin coat of crazy glue, across the saddle, thus making it .00x inches wider, so it sits better it tighter on the slot...

Is it a good idea just for now? hopefully, well, i remember once Bob Colosi told me to coat a bit with crazy glue a bridge pins set I bought from him, to fit them tighter,
It may do the trick too this time...

[unclrob]

not a fan of super glue but if it works for the experiment I don't see a problem.

[Duque]

Yeah me neither, I sort of don't like having an "almost right" work too using glue, being a saddle or a nut fixed, but I guess to try it should work.. will do it as I get back from work...