I've been playing a long time, and it didn't come easy. Not as talented as I was full of desire. So it's taken me a long time to get decent. Along the way, just by digging and playing around I've found things I wish I would have known when I was much younger. Things you may not see in books. For me that usually means easier ways of doing things so you can do more. In other words chord fingerings that allow you no add notes and runs while still holding chord or simple movements that can walk into next chord. Here's one. If this thread gets interest I'll add more.
A chord that's rarely in books and I use all the time, especially up neck. (it'd be so cool if there was a blank chord diagram you could click on, and then fill in) let me put it in words. Make an open D. lift up ring finger from 2nd string and put middle finger there. Put ring finger on 4th string 4th fret.  depending on where you are on neck you mute first string or let it ring. now besides having a chord that sounds especially good up neck
when you can let E ring, you can use pinky to add notes. 1st to mind comes basic rock and roll lick by putting pinky down next to ring on 3rd string
(6TH)then pinky up a fret (7th) then back down a fret.  or walk the pinky up and on the last beat grab the next higher chord form for that same chord. Also you'll find IV and V chord very close by. If you use a certain 9th you barely have to move your fingers.
another open D based chord. Again we're gonna use 2nd,3rd and 4th string and abandon first if needed. make basic D7. Move it up 2 frets so we're making an E7. ring finger to 3rd string 4th fret.middle finger to 2nd string 3rd fret. now take 1st finger to 4th string 2nd fret. I think this is a very cool and warm sounding 7th. Move it up to where it becomes an A chord up neck. VERY cool as open strings ring. Slide up to it from half step down. Heard that before? Also ptetty easy to slide into that E7 from a regular open E . even if you just get 2nd and 3rd string for 7th.
Anyway got any tips on things youv'e discovered. Maybe it won't have to be years between my simple discoveries. I think this could be a great thread if averybody shared tips. I've got more if people interested. thanks.

Quote from: flatlander on April 27, 2007, 03:58:19 PM
A chord that's rarely in books and I use all the time, especially up neck. (it'd be so cool if there was a blank chord diagram you could click on, and then fill in) let me put it in words. Make an open D. lift up ring finger from 2nd string and put middle finger there. Put ring finger on 4th string 4th fret.  depending on where you are on neck you mute first string or let it ring. now besides having a chord that sounds especially good up neck
when you can let E ring, you can use pinky to add notes. 1st to mind comes basic rock and roll lick by putting pinky down next to ring on 3rd string
(6TH)then pinky up a fret (7th) then back down a fret.  or walk the pinky up and on the last beat grab the next higher chord form for that same chord. Also you'll find IV and V chord very close by. If you use a certain 9th you barely have to move your fingers.
another open D based chord. Again we're gonna use 2nd,3rd and 4th string and abandon first if needed. make basic D7. Move it up 2 frets so we're making an E7. ring finger to 3rd string 4th fret.middle finger to 2nd string 3rd fret. now take 1st finger to 4th string 2nd fret. I think this is a very cool and warm sounding 7th. Move it up to where it becomes an A chord up neck. VERY cool as open strings ring. Slide up to it from half step down. Heard that before? Also ptetty easy to slide into that E7 from a regular open E . even if you just get 2nd and 3rd string for 7th.
Anyway got any tips on things youv'e discovered. Maybe it won't have to be years between my simple discoveries. I think this could be a great thread if averybody shared tips. I've got more if people interested. thanks.

Try putting them here:

http://www.jguitar.com/chordname

That tool is cool but for that 1st chord example I gave (D) it gave me
f#m#5
a6sus4/#5
and d/f# major
I try to keep it simple man! It's still a simple d triad. all I did was move f#(3rd) from 1st string to 4th string.
1-3-5 notes from d scale.
the E7 was better. It said E7 omit 3rd, which was right.
I like it though for the various names it gives you. when you strip chords down/drop root or 5th they can become more related to more chords. I think I can get some substution idea's by what it spits out.

OK here's a good tip.

Don't try to walk thru a doorway with your guitar in playing position.It will damage the wall and p*** off you wife and damage the guitar.





Also Never eat the yellow snow.


Don't play the electric acoustic or any other electric guitar in the shower.

There is a free shareware program called NutChords that is also very handy for chord structures as well as scales. You can probably search the net for it. But, if anyone would like a copy, just send me your email and I can send you the zip installation folder. I use it all the time because I can insert chords into lyric sheets.

Quote from: unclrob on April 27, 2007, 10:07:37 PM

Also Never eat the yellow snow.

That's one of the first lessons we learn growing up in the north unclrob. It's right up there with "Don't touch your tongue to a metal post when it's freezing outside."

Brian

Quote from: unclrob on April 27, 2007, 10:07:37 PM
OK here's a good tip.

Don't try to walk thru a doorway with your guitar in playing position.It will damage the wall and p*** off you wife and damage the guitar.





Also Never eat the yellow snow.


Don't play the electric acoustic or any other electric guitar in the shower.

How about don't fry bacon without a shirt on?

unclrob?  How often do you see yellow snow in Tallahassee?

I use to live in NY.

Never beat the bass player with the headstock end of the guitar.It just breaks off and you bass player still not any smarter. :humour:,I also double on bass.

Tip for self. don't expect serious responses to this thread. I might add one more later to make sure no one is interested. Yes yellow snow has a different meaning in FLA.

Flatlander please forgive me,sometimes I can't help myself. :crying:



Heres a real cool guitar playing tip:

I went out and bought 12 million guitar chords book and practice playing song with dfferant chord voices,what I got from this is the ability to move my fingers to form chords smoothly.It taught me more fingerboard knowledge then playing scales.

Ok heres another simple GUITAR related tip. Make open G with pinky on 1st string and ring next to it on 2nd string.( a tip in itself if you don't already do that, rings and helps with that wierd open b) slide pinky and ring up to 5th fret, then ring to 7th fret(same string) and middle to
1st string 6th fret. You can let open 3rd string play. You just moved between 2 g chords and it was easy and gave movement. A lot can be more can be done if you continue up playing thirds or whatever. But just doing that movement by itself is cool and you can simply drop back to open G chord if you want. Same type of thing can be done with other chords once you get hang of it. Open D, then 1st finger 3rd fret, ring 5th fret, then slide up 2 frets with that same fingering to another d chord. may want to add 3rd string 7th fret at that point. When you get the D thing down, you can apply it to any D shape chord up neck like G at 7th fret or A at nineth. After a while you can do melodys using that teqnique and have your guitar heard more that just single string. same can be done on middle strings, but a little more difficult. Anybody intersted? Got anything for me?

Quote from: unclrob on April 30, 2007, 09:21:40 AM
Flatlander please forgive me,sometimes I can't help myself. :crying:



Heres a real cool guitar playing tip:

I went out and bought 12 million guitar chords book and practice playing song with dfferant chord voices,what I got from this is the ability to move my fingers to form chords smoothly.It taught me more fingerboard knowledge then playing scales.

please don't cry! No forgiveness needed. At this point I just like sharing things it took me forever to dig out and hoping people can share things they've found, especially, but not confined to making things easier or doing cool things that aren't hard.
Yes chord books are great and understanding how chords are made. A good tip along those lines is know where the root is and realize that if you
drop it one tone it's major 7, 2 and it's flatted seventh, 3 and it's 6th, 4 and it's aumented 5th. Of course you may have to change string.
But the most useful thing for me was just understanding how they were made, and finding my own which are stripped down versions that aren't such a stretch and free a finger up to do hammer ons or adding notes to form in any fashion. All those notes don't have to be there for my level of playing and I can moves between chords quicker.

Quote from: unclrob on April 29, 2007, 10:52:09 PM
Never beat the bass player with the headstock end of the guitar.It just breaks off and you bass player still not any smarter.

Nothing like personal experience to make one wiser.  Who else but unclrob could pass on this gem for our collective benefit!

jimmy

Quote from: jimmy buffett on April 30, 2007, 10:36:03 AM
Nothing like personal experience to make one wiser.  Who else but unclrob could pass on this gem for our collective benefit!

jimmy

Acually decent bass players are too rare to beat. When I find one I chain them up in basement. Then feed them and most importantly give them beer, which keeps them loyal.

A few things come to mind with me.....

For a great strumming sound, use as thick a pick as you can find, but angle it to where it "brushes" up against the stings instead of digging in head-on like with a lighter pick.  You can get a really great...and really loud....strumming tone like this, but you can also use the thick pick to really dig into some lead lines when needed.  I gave up on thin picks a long time ago once I figured out this technique, which is probably old news to most of you here.

Also, I find that using the C/G chord, or as I call it "the full C" sounds so much better in most cases than just a regular C chord.  You can not only grab that great alternating bass line with the G note, but you can also strum all the strings while doing a C, which makes the chord ring so much better.

And most importantly for me, I always use the heaviest strings I can find and keep my guitars tuned down a whole step.  This is good for many reasons, but most of which are the various keys you can use on the fly by keeping a capo handy.  But most of all, to me, there's nothing like the low end growl of a dread strung heavy and tuned down. 

Thanks! lets keep em rollin. Also with "full" C you can do little walk just by hitting 6th string, then lifting ring off of 5th string, then putting it back down. bom bom bom. add pinky to 1st string 3rd fret while making that chord. sometimes that's good and you can leave that note to ring,drone, while changing to G.

flatlander, your first example with the D major chord is a D9 (with first string played open). 

Quote from: 12barBill on April 30, 2007, 04:34:22 PM
flatlander, your first example with the D major chord is a D9 (with first string played open). 

That's right. you can let first string ring or mute depending on where you are on neck and if you want that note in there. making an A on 9th fret you can hit all strings if you wish and still have a straight A.    2nd 3rd and 4th string make triad. But the real thing about that chord is that it allows you to use your pinky to add notes and gives you an easy,flexible chord to use up neck.

Here's something I've gotten into doing.On Tuesday nite scotch and guitar night we have a guy who play's constant lead thru all the songs,it started as a goof but its increased my lead ability.I play all my leads in the form of chords.This has made chord/melody playing easier to understand for me.

Quote from: unclrob on April 30, 2007, 10:31:27 PM
Here's something I've gotten into doing.On Tuesday nite scotch and guitar night we have a guy who play's constant lead thru all the songs,it started as a goof but its increased my lead ability.I play all my leads in the form of chords.This has made chord/melody playing easier to understand for me.

very cool. I play leads usually with 2 strings maybe 3 and working into those stripped down chords I mentioned earlier, but I would really be getting there if I could use fuller chords that way. I love western swing or that old chunky jazz rythm where those cats can change chords every beat.Fats wallers guitar player is a good example. ....we have whiskey and gospel night. feels alright.....

Quote from: flatlander on May 01, 2007, 01:57:47 AM
....we have whiskey and gospel night. feels alright.....

Now why didn't I think of that? 

"Honey, I'm off to gospel tonight.  Don't wait up!"   :wave :nana_guitar :nanadance :wave

jimmy

Reminds of a joke that I can't repeat here. The best tip one can give a budding musician, never mind guitarists, is ... listen.

Very true. Further more if I'm playing with a good bass player I'll not only listen but when I can, watch his right hand and trigger off of that. His timing is probably better than mine.

Thanks for the tips.  This is good stuff.  I'm following along.   I'm glad to have any help I can get when it comes to playing up the neck. 

Flatlander, as you already know, the wisecracks go with the territory.  They just make things a little more interesting.

Quote from: norseman40 on May 06, 2007, 12:23:03 PM
Thanks for the tips.  This is good stuff.  I'm following along.   I'm glad to have any help I can get when it comes to playing up the neck. 

Flatlander, as you already know, the wisecracks go with the territory.  They just make things a little more interesting.

I'm cool. wasn't kidding about whishey and gospel night though. Here's another one. The aug7. made like an chopped down F thats made on the 1st 4 strings except that shape is on 2,3,4,5 string. It serves as a 5th to that F shape chord. So we're in A playing the F shaped chord at 5th fret. at the end of a 12 bar blues can go EEEE DDDD AAAA then the aug 7th. ( I think it can be named by any note in chord)  very easy hand movement, just move all fingers up a string. Since the aug 7 repeats itself every 4 frets, you can also split it's time and for the last beat or whatever, slide it up 4 frets (or down) It also works about the same for the D shaped chord I was talking about earlier made on 2,3,4 string. Notice how the aug chord is right there for it as well for that tag at end. Norseman I mentioned earlier about going from the D type chord to a 9th for the IV chord which is right there. did you follow? You can play your I IV V blues and barely move your hands. To me there's 2 basic types of 9ths, the one that's pretty much a C7 shape with 2nd string 3rd fret added, and the other one. The other one is what I'm talking about that is so close to D shape chord. If you don't know it and care I'll spell it out...................later. 
I know there's a lot better players than me out there, share something!

I like this little chord (in tab):


-------------
-----1-------
-----2-------
-------------
-----3-------
-------------

Why don't you guys just write out your chords in the normal tab form....
(each number represents the fret, strings EADGbe)
i.e.

C: x32010
C: 332010
C: x32033 (works well if you are playing in the key of G)
C: 8x0088 (also good in key of G, like the blackbird song by the beatles)
C#m: x46200

Ok I went overboard.  The last one is way easier with a cut capo.  I might post more later if I'm not too lazy.
Only downside is it doesn't include fingering, but oh wells!

Quote from: tbman on May 09, 2007, 06:12:42 PM
I like this little chord (in tab):


-------------
-----1-------
-----2-------
-------------
-----3-------
-------------

I think you're missing a few notes there. You've got CAC as written.

As per other thread resurrecting this thread. There's some goofin, but good info as well. I'll start by adding a few chords that are up the neck but pretty easy and utilize a lot of open strings even though the fretted ones are up the neck. My 000-60 sounds absolutely incredible with these chords and I suggest any owners of them check these out if they don't already use them.

A at 5th fret.  ---------------------0    pinky free to jam around with hammers, pull offs whatever
                     ---------------------5 I
                     ---------------------6 M
                     ---------------------7 R
                     ---------------------0
                     ---------------------5 w/thumb

D chord, notice the easy transition from A to the IV chord

                     ---------------------5 I
                     ---------------------7 P
                     ---------------------7 R
                     ---------------------0
                     ---------------------0
                     ---------------------5 T

Glorious sounding E chord
                     ---------------------0
                     ---------------------0
                     ---------------------9 pinky
                     ---------------------9 ring
                     ---------------------7 index
                     ---------------------0
So there's the I, IV, V in the key of A with these cool ,chimey, up the neck open chords. I'm on a quest for these kinds of chords so if anybody has some to add, I'd appreciate it. Like I said, they sound angelic on 000-60. As always see what notes you can add or change to triad to find new chords. examples. Shxt, I'm getting carried away, anyway....
On A chord I on 2nd string is 5th, so pinky on 7th fret makes it a 6th chord. 7th fret a 7th chord (dom)
On E chord example pinky is root so fret below it is as always gonna be major 7th. So replace pinky withe middle finger a fret lower and it a pretty E maj 7. Lower it another fret and you have a bluesy E 7th (dom) A little harder chord to finger, may require pinky to cover 4th string.  One last related tip along those lines. Remember when you were first learning how hard even the big open chords were to learn? After a few months not so bad. The same applies to learning new chords now. Hope someone enjoys and adds some more!

Here's a little something - if you're interested...

"Internal" chords. I'm a great believer in using as much of the fretboard as possible, and one of the things that puts guitar newbies off doing this is the dreaded barré chord. Now, several eminent guitarists, of which one of the greatest was Eddie Lang, got great speed and flexibility by using "internal" chords. Note that I say "internal", rather than "part". By using the internal 4 strings (say) of the guitar, you can get nice, expressive chord changes without the worry of the barré.

Example: x 5 4 5 3 x (D7)
               x 6 5 6 4 x (Eb7)

Example: x 5 5 4 3 x (G)
               x 6 6 5 4 x (Ab)

Example: x 5 4 4 3 x (D6)
               x 6 5 5 4 x (Eb6)

etc. The point is that if you asked a relative beginner to play the sequence Eb7 / / / Ab / / / they'd probably think it difficult. T'aint!

Playing fingerstyle helps here, as you can ignore picking the 6th and 1st strings, but controlled plectrum work will also allow you to strum the inner 4 strings. This isn't rocket science, but a lot of players don't seem to be aware of the possibilities...

Will

One thing that helped me find new ways to express myself musically was utilizing open tunings. Tune to a G, E, D,Dminor, etc and then just use the chord shapes you know from standard tuning and move them about the fretboard and you will discover all kinds of great sounding cool inversions. You get the benefit of using shapes you are already familiar fingering, but the alternate tuning creates different relationships with those shapes so its a win, win in my book. Plus, it helps develop your ear simply because you really don't know what you are playing and have to really listen to the changes you are constructing! Happy hunting!

dont show off in a guitar store if your checking out insrtuments, It annoys people and it makes you look like an -CENSORED-
Dave

OK how many of you use a lot of preasure to hold down the chords?I tell a lot of people to lighten up all you need to do is crest the fret.By pressing real hard you can push the guitar out of tune.I  know that this is a tuff thing to do because it seems that the harder you strum the more you squeeze.To help change this effect try playing thru the chord scale with a lite touch while strumming pregressivly harder.It took me 2 years to break the habit as a result I have a very lite touch.

GA-ME I like that one and I didn't realize that. I haven't done much with open tunings, just dropped d. But I'm gonna check that out for sure. Funny how those things work out on a guitar, like the same shape penatonic scale working for major or blues depending on where it's located.
Yea Rob I can be a squeezer for sure even as I try to control myself.
When I check out a guitar in store I generally just strum different chords mainly Then finger pick a little, not even a bonafide song and hit a quick lick or 2 just to see how fast she'll go with ole mud track driver.

Here are a couple of easy E chords at the 5th fret that I find myself using a lot to get a 'different' sound when jamming.

1. C:  {0 7 5 7 0 0}:  Em7

2.  C:  {0 7 6 7 5 0}: E7 (this is basically a C7 shape moved up the neck)

Thanks Randy. The Em7 new to me and I will experiment with it.
I just had a moment which is an example of why it's been a long road. If you blessed with having a direct line from inner brain or gut to fingers you're lucky.
I was messing with the open chords I put up last night and realized that when going from the E to E7 it can be pretty easy. If you just have Index finger barring across  7th fret on strings 3,4,5. then all you have to do is lift pinky!
The context in which that came to me was pretty cool as well. Just dinking with some words while playing those 3 chords, actually playing out of E not A (which brings up a question I'll get to later). Very majory feeling, girl leaving blah, blah, blah. Some of us are familier with women that once they make up thier mind, that's it. The line is "when she made up her mind, she made it hard" Initial thought was hard as in solid, wasn't going back, but it can have the double meaning of, hard on me! when the hard on me aspect hit me in mid beat I automatically just laid my index across to get bluesy 7th. Maybe that famous song should go "if I only didn't have a brain" instead of "if I only had a brain!

OK here's a good tip.

Don't try to walk thru a doorway with your guitar in playing position.It will damage the wall and p*** off you wife and damage the guitar.

Also Never eat the yellow snow.

Don't play the electric acoustic or any other electric guitar in the shower.
[/quote]

Also, "Growing OLD isn't so BAD, IF you think of the ALTERNATIVE."

I know that this isn't really a tip, but many of this forum's Members are geezers (i.e., over 50) ... like me ... and well    :cheers

I think at a certain point playing other people's music gets in the way of our own creativity and our own particular way of playing that is there if we dig hard enough and keep at the daydreamy noodling.

I wonder if we become better musicians if we stop listening to guitar players as well. Maybe I've been playing too long -- these days the drummer/singer/violin player and so on have more to say to me musically, are more interesting to me, than the guitar player.

I'm always walking the line on that one. If a new song is brewing, and I mean to write, that takes priority.
After that it is not only a battle between original music and other peoples music but between other peoples music I really like and covers needed to keep bar owners happy. I've held to my guns better that the average bear, but I do feel it can be a little easier to present unfamilier music with a band as it has more power, and these days I'm solo for the most part.
For me I wouldn't say stop listening to guitar players but definately listen to other instruments as well.It's all a balancing act with not enough hours in the day.

  Nice RE:THREAD Matt, I just read the whole thing (Old and New) My brains a bit foggy right now with too much info.
       But here's a tip, no joke. Spend more time playing than talking about it. Frank Zappa put it a bit more crudely "Shut up and play yer guitar"
                    I realize I spend more time "talking" than "playing" and I'll never get better that way.
           So this thread is good for doing just that, tips on playing, not which wood or tuners,strings, and so on.

         (So just what is whiskey and gospel night? Sounds like an Elvis thing.)

Quote from: GA-ME on October 28, 2008, 09:04:01 AM
One thing that helped me find new ways to express myself musically was utilizing open tunings. Tune to a G, E, D,Dminor, etc and then just use the chord shapes you know from standard tuning and move them about the fretboard and you will discover all kinds of great sounding cool inversions. You get the benefit of using shapes you are already familiar fingering, but the alternate tuning creates different relationships with those shapes so its a win, win in my book. Plus, it helps develop your ear simply because you really don't know what you are playing and have to really listen to the changes you are constructing! Happy hunting!

+1 to that, exactly what I did when I started to explore the open C tuning. Even if there'd be chord diagrams available, I don't care - just trying to figure out grips myself.
Furthermore, while doing so, listen to yourself and let these new harmonics inspire you into writing new stuff. Works for me.
Eventually you'll need to look for new strings as well and - of course - new guitars  :tongue:

Great post flatlander...thanks to everyone for the tips.  As a novice trying desperately to become intermediate, I'm loving these tips.

Thanks to all   :cheers

So maybe a novice/intermediate can toss in some advice as well...
OK, here's an easy one that sounds great.  "Strange Fire" by the Indigo girls.

E (standard) 4x, 4 beats, that is..
007600  2x (slide up the neck and raise the middle finger)
E 4x
007600 2x

000230 2x
000233 2x hammer hold
000230 1x
002100 2x

000230 2x
000233 2x hammer hold
000230 1x
002100 2x

099800 (standard E slid up the neck, nice and jangly) 4x
007600 2x (move back down two frets and raise the middle finger)
then repeat back to the deep standard E (really thump the bass strings!)

This was the first song I learned that included chords other than the standard forms in the first three frets.  I still love it and play it all the time.

Be well, Penner

Thanks for keeping things rolling!
Side note. I lived in little five points in Atlanta when they were getting started. Saw them quite a few times. (I have to really like someone to see them more the a time or 2) Emily was always a very good musician. Amy solid rythm.  Together, well they are one of those types that were meant to be together. A chemistry like family. Great harmony and great songwriters. I remember 20 years ago now, having breakfast (noon) at LFP pub and they were sitting in booth next to me plotting thier carreer. With thier glasses on and both looking quite studious with papers scattered all over table. They had hooked up with REM manager/promoter? Mr Russell I believe, a lawyer from Decatur. Anyway a few months later that first national album came out and the rest is history. Congrats to them. 2 fine women who do a lot to try to make the world a better place. I've still got one of thier mic stands from a mix up at gig. I'm sure they've replaced mine they inadvertantly got!
With the 3 open up the neck chords I put in a couple posts ago, I've written a song. When I get a couple little kinks worked out I'll share.

Cool story.  I saw them warm up for REM on that tour, it was quite a treat!

Pennerblue. I looking at what you supplied this a.m. You added anther chord for my open the neck opens and on that could spawn more using 3rd and 4th strings fretted. That's the 007600.. Those are the kind of things Emily always did that I couldn't pick up on at the time just watching.. The ones up the neck. upon further exploration. (doesn't that sound heavy?!) The E and Em chords are particularly "open" to this idea as so many open string are part of chords.  A couple examples that work good out of Em
from bass to trebles
0 10 9 0 0 0
0 9 7 0 0 0 (Use open strings at own discretion and peril
0 7 5 0 0 0
0 5 5 0 0 0
Of course reg Em which can be hammered on from open nicely as well as quick slide from Em to 0 5 5 0 0 0 and back.
Try walking these chords right down the line and adding hammers and or slide up to 5th to get familiar!
Keep em comin and when I have a chance I need to go back and notate my earlier post properly. 

This will probably not be of much interest to anyone, but I came on this forum as a novice of 10 years attempted self teaching, and have already picked up tips from friendly folk on here that have advanced me more in 4 months, since I became a Larry owner, than i did in the previous 10 years put together.

If there is anyone else who is as pathetic a player as me, this might be worth something, though.  I have been learning a lot of Neil Young tracks lately, and ones that were tabbed with dropped tunigs I ignored as beyond me.  Today I tried some of them (Ohio and Don't Let it get You Down) and was impressed with how easy it was, what new sunds were opened up and how good these simple tracks sounded.  I learned them both in DADGBD.  If you are a beginner, and haven't tried this, do it now!!!!

Thanks again to everyone who has helped me on here.

" I learned them both in DADGBD.  If you are a beginner, and haven't tried this, do it now!!!!"
Try midnight rider in that tuning. D just fretting 2&3 strings. A lot of people use some kind of C and G for the other 2 chords which kinda works but it's actually m7th's G to A like 3x333x - 5x555x. I get the 2-3-4 strings by smashing (barre) with ring and middle finger on 6th.
Also check this with that tuning to get started.
000230 (the D) but up to likes of these 000560  000780  (000 -10- 10- 0) Then find more incoperating the 1st string as well. You can play some pretty easy lead type stuff while guitar is ringing and full.
Go to http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=869113 and click on rainmaker for an example of this. Capo on 2nd fret for that. If I'm counting right, specifically on the 5th and 6th meausre of break it's all 2nd and 3rd string only fretted, and sliding it around up the neck. You don't have to do it that fast. Listen what you can do with bass runs as well. Also note that all of intro part has 2nd and 3rd string fretted, except 2 brief hammers on 3rd. The rest is just notes added over chord. For you audiophiles I just banged this into cheap CDR right after I wrote. Not meant to be examples of tone, pickin or anything else other than message of song still filled with the emotion that wrote it!

This thread has been teaching this old dog some new chords - Thanks all.
I can't think of individual tips for chords, but here's a song with some neat sounding chords.
One of the first rock songs that I ever learned.
Emerson, Lake & Palmer's From the Beginning.
Generally an Am to G song. If you've never heard it, you need to try to look it up somewhere to hear the rhythm/groove.

Start with chords Am9 = X07500 to Em11 = X05030 a couple of times. Then

Hit with low E string open, bend it twice at the 2nd fret, then open A string once, then:
Am9 = X07500
Em11 = X05030
C = X3201X - walk down
Cmaj9 = X2001X
Fmaj9 = XX3210
G = XX5433
Dm7 = XX0565 hammer on/pull off high E string 5 to 6 to 5
Chorus is
Dm7 = XX0565
G = XX5433
Dm7 = XX0565
E7sus4(addF) = 023230
Jam on Am to G (or Am9 to Em11).

I got these chord's names from the internet, so the names are probably not right. I looked this song up at maybe chordie.com and saw variations but I never took the time to listen to ELP and figure out what's exactly right. The version that I learned above always sounded okay to me.
Thanks again - keep em coming
JBaer

This is gettin cool. I'm learning chords to add to my arsenal. Thanks!

Basic chord theory for biginners or people who never got around to learning.
Chords are named by referencing the major scale of the key that is the name of that chord. In other words for a C type chord you're referencing C major scale. (do-re-mi ect) for D chord you're referencing D Major scale.
do is I, re is II, mi is III fa is IV, so is V, la is VI, to is VII "and that brings us back to DOOOOO(sorry) This Do is octive. Keep going above octive and you end up with 9th 11'th 13th ect.
Chords are named by what notes out of that scale you are using or what you've done with them, (flatted, raised)
Major chord uses 1st, 3rd, 5th notes out of scale
Minor uses 1st, flatted 3rd(lower 1/2 step or 1 fret) and 5th.
Suspended short for suspended 4th. just add 4th note in scale. I guess it's called suspended because that's how it sounds. Wants to get back to 3.
Augmented is short for Augmented(raised) 5th In C knock G note up to G#
Dominent flats 7th note in scale. Often just notated as (x)7 a major 7th uses non flatted 7th and is notatated Maj 7
Diminished   flat 3, flat 5 and 6th. can be named by any note in chord and repeats itself every 3 frets up (or down)
The rest of names are pretty much just what note you added from scale to chord.
A  C6 just adds the 6th note (A) to chord.
9ths, 11ths, 13ths aren't always octive above root. A D9 could be thought of as a D2 sometimes but of course that terminoligy is never used. Well that's all times allows. Hope that's somewhat clear. Any ?'s ask. Or if someone with better knowledge wants to add
or correct (I don't think I said anything outright incorrect) please add comments.

 :crying: I had another post ready about what chords were in a key and why but I lost it! Later. :crying:

On post that got lost, there was a pretty long explantion of why certain chords made up chords used most of the time for certain key.
It also stated that basic deal was not hard and fast rules.
I'll redo it later, but I was going to throw out a question for any teachers or folks more deep into theory.
On premise that chords for Maj key go Maj min min Maj Maj Min and Minor Flat 5 why..........
Does II maj chord fit so well as used so often in southern Gospel and country songs as it goes to V?
Why Does Min V chord work like in simple D to Am to G progression?
And VII chord as major as in something like Know You Rider. G-F-C-G? Someone told me that some old songs like that used to use a G7 instead of F. The F was a modern thing.  So the F note being the 7th in G7 can be subbed by entire F chord? Thanks

  Matt I did practice today. At least more than the last 3 days. I started learning a new finger style and my very talented friend whom sold me my Martin OM-21 was over today and taught me some more about chord interaction.
     He played my 00-09 FM and really made it sing. I really do hope to get more time in playing.

Quote from: dependan on November 04, 2008, 08:49:48 PM
 my very talented friend whom sold me my Martin OM-21 was over today and taught me some more about chord interaction.
   

Care to share? Regurgitating it is a way to remember and understand better. Love to hear other input, especially about chord interaction.
I'm just a 1/2 axx player that wants to share what little I learned cause it took me so long to figure it out. Love to hear from others.

Quote from: flatlander on November 04, 2008, 09:55:03 PM
Care to share? Regurgitating it is a way to remember and understand better. Love to hear other input, especially about chord interaction.
I'm just a 1/2 axx player that wants to share what little I learned cause it took me so long to figure it out. Love to hear from others.

He's the one with the talent and ability to teach it, I am a grasshopper. When I can grasp it a little better and can put it down in the correct manner I'll write it down.
                One of the details that seems a bit strange to me (unless I heard it or remember it wrong) is that if you played an A minor while others were playing D it wouldn't be noticed.
                I know for sure that is true about C and A minor. So as you can see I'm a bit unsure of A minor and D being closely related.  It you are 1/2 I'm 1/32cnd.
                          But I am having fun and learning new things, SLOWLY. As someone on the forum says in their sig.
                 "More guitars than talent"  Something like that.
                                                                Danny

Here's what I did to help me learn songs and put fun back into playing my guitars.

I made a list of 6 songs I wanted to learn. I wrote the name of each song and its tuning on a "sticky" and stuck it to the bridge of the assigned guitar. Some songs are easier than others so if I get frustrated with a hard song, I just put the guitar down, grab a different guitar and grab the music that goes with the guitar and start practicing it. Now, I don't have that I HAVE TO FINISH THIS SONG feeling that I used to get. 'Cause, now I don't have to finish them. I can work on them at my leisure, finish the easier ones and replace them with another song of the approximately same difficulty. I also keep one or two guitars in standard tuning for those moments when I just want to rip off a little bluesy stuff when I'm half asleep and don't feel like concentrating. A little organization goes a long way. :nana_guitar

Well I'm 1/2 awake after 5 hrs each way yesterday to kill devils hills and gettin home at 3:00 a.m.  While I wait for the coffee to take afftect..........
It's good to know that open E, open A, and open D are really the same chord form, in a way. You're just moving the whole chord over a string. Since the B, 2nd string, has a different interval from 3rd string than all the other strings have to each other, you just have to compensate when when moving chord over a string. Anyone who plays mandolin knows that the interval is the same between all strings. Once you learn a chord form, you can just move it over  a string with same shape and have same type of chord a 4th or 5th away depending which way you're going. On guitar when the 2nd string is involved if you go from E to A you must raise the finger moving to 2nd string up a fret because 2nd string is tuned lower. When going from A to D again the finger moving from 3rd to 2nd string must move up a fret to compensate giving D shape.
  So the fetted notes on any of these triads always have the same interval. Lowest(pitchwise) fretted note is 5th. middle fretted note is 1st and highest fretted note is 3rd. If you understand that well, then you realize that when you learn one new chord form, you are really learning 3 providing fingering works.
Example" to go from open chord E to E sus (4th) you just raise highest(again tone wise) note one fret, changing it from 3rd to 4th in chord context. The same applies to open A and open D.      So on open E your raising the 3rd string 1 fret. on open A you raise the 2nd string 1 fret and D  raise the 1st string one fret . It took my a little while to realize that. Hope it saves someone some time.

WHAT CHORDS ARE IN A KEY AND WHY

Gonna redo this that I inadvertly deleted  a couple weeks ago.

When in a certain key what chords are likely to work? First know that these are not hard and fast rules, but generally speaking.
Lets take key of C for simplicity. C has no sharps or flats so the NOTES that make up C major are c-d-e-f-g-a-b then repeat.
On keyboards thats white keys only. The standard triad chords that fit a key uses only the notes that are in that key. (talking triads, not dominent, or any kind of dim or altered ect)
You start with the c note for first chord. Take the 1st, 3rd, and 5th notes (every other note in the c maj scale) and you end up with C E G which is a C Chord.
Move up to the next note in scale, D and do the same thing. 1st, 3rd, 5th notes starting with D, using only the notes from C scale.You end up with DFA. If you refernce back to how chords are named a couple of post back, you see that is a Dm chord.
Up again to starting with E and taking  every other note that's in the C Major scale. 1-3-5 and you have Em
Starting with F you get F major
Starting with G you get G major
Starting with A you get Am
Starting with B you get B b3b5 (B with flatted 3rd and flatted 5th) That can sound scarey but if you go back to how chords are named it should make sense.
In summary all you are doing is using the ONLY THE NOTES THAT ARE IN THE SCALE YOU ARE PLAYING IN to make basic triad.
Start with each note from that scale and take every other note above it, (1-3-5) to make chord!
No matter what MAJOR key you are playing in the sequence will always be Maj min min Maj Maj Min and (b3 b5)
Again this is MOST of the time and generally speaking.  Many are familier for example of using the II chord as a major in like a country or southern gospel song. Hope somebody learns something. As always if I gaffed something pounding this out quickly, please correct me. I don't think so.

Found this link also which explains pretty much the same way but maybe a thing or 2 to add.
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/lessons/chords/what_chords_are_in_what_key_and_why.html

Doesn't seem to be a lot of interest in this still. I searched around last night and found a great place if this is what your into. Bang,bang,bang go the post and responses about theory. progressions, techniques and much more.
I'm beside myself with excitement.
If you want to know the site, let me know. More for actually playing,recording, gigging than discussion about guitars themselves.

I'm interested, it's just SOOOOOOO much further along than I am,lol. So I'd like it to be around when I can comprehend it.

holly

Flatlander,

Interested.  What site are you referring to?

http://www.jsguitarforum.com/forum/index.php

For chord/theory/ technique stuff  drop down to woodshed.  Very knowedable people folks there. Lessons, samples of what different modes sound like ect. Check out guitar theory lessons at bottom of woodsheding. I've just scratched the surface looking over threads. Some of it's a bit much for me but lots of stuff I can use, to dig out as well. I like to take those things and apply them in a relitively easy manner so I can make the most out of where my hands are already. Very few big stretch chords here. They also have lots of other areas of interest including acoustic section and a couple just fun forums. If anybody has questions about anything I posted ask and I'll try to explain. The next thing I was going to post on was 3rd's used in context of lead. If anyone wants to know about how I use them just ask and I'll post. Best thing I ever started doing. If anyone else want to add thier own tips here please do. I've learned some cool new chords from this thread. I don't hold a candle to some of these guys on other site, but I do think I know some tricks that are pretty easy that really beef up your playing. Cheers.

Quote from: strawintogold on November 17, 2008, 12:37:08 PM
I'm interested, it's just SOOOOOOO much further along than I am,lol. So I'd like it to be around when I can comprehend it.

holly

They have lessons for beginners as well. Get started on it now a bit at a time at least and it will make your journey quicker.

Thanks for the Link Flatlander.

I tool a quick look and there looks like there's a lot of good info to be had.

Flatlander,

I would love to hear your info on thirds, please do share.  I make it a point  to check this thread whenever something new has been added.  I've incorporated some of what has already been posted into my playing, so thanks.  Wish I could offer more myself, but I'm more of sponge at my stage of development.

Hey I'm glad to! Just wanted to make sure someone was looking at this stuff. To reiterate. I AM NOT A GUITAR WIZARD. I've been playing since I was 15 and I'm 51 now. (What a difference flipping the 1 and 5 around make huh?) This stuff came SLOW to me. My desire is to share these things that I came to the hard way. Like every 2 years coming across something cool an then exploring it and ABUSING it. My thing has alway been to find things that a half axx player(myself) can do that aren't that hard but really add a lot.
Yes things like the 3rds take some practice and work, but God willin and the creek don't rise, time WILL go by and a year or two later they come quite naturally! Remember this. The hardest thing may be getting started on guitar. Those torturous hours of changing from G to C to D. And then just when you're feelin all big you go for the F chord. Sometimes I think they call it F for a reason.
These 3rds and a lots of other little movements I've put on here are no where near as hard as learning F. If you put 1/4th the work in as you did learning F you can expand. That was way to much rambling.............................

Starting to use 3rd's for leads or walk ups to after years of playing is one of the best things I've ever done. Highly recommended.
I'm going to put just the notes AND explain it theory wise. If the theory is confusing, forget it. Get back to it later though.
I consider this first set to be based out of D shape chord. If you walk these 3rds straight up the neck you get the D major scale in 3rd's
Do RE MI-----------
1/------------2------3-------5-------7----------9------------10----------12----------14---
2/------------3-------5-------7-------8---------10-----------12----------14----------15--
3/-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
4/-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
5/-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
6/-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You're only using 2 fingers, not hard! Just a matter of learning pattern. Learn the whole pattern straight up the neck to start. But when using in practical terms you'll usually just us portions. Here's a couple of very simple ways to start incorporating them into playing 1 step at a time.. Your playing in D just do this
1/---------2----------3---------2------------------------------------------------------------
2/----------3----------5--------3-------------------------------------------------------------
3/----------2---------------------2----------------------------------------------------------
4/-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
5/-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
6/-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That's right just splitting the time you're spending on D by going up and right back down. Next step. Take it one notch higher.
1/---------2----------3---------5------------------------------------------------------------
2/----------3----------5--------7-------------------------------------------------------------
3/----------2--------------------(7)----------------------------------------------------------
4/---------------------------------(0)-------------------------------------------------------
5/---------------------------------(0)--------------------------------------------------------
6/----------------------------------(5)with thumb---------------------------------------
Here your doing the same thing but playing the D chord on 5th and 7th fret. LISTEN, when using the 3rd position as a D chord go ahead and play the 3rd string as well. That not only makes it fuller but defines it as a D chord clearly.  Don't get hung up on this right now but theres more to say about that. I won't muddy the water,yet. The important thing is to get used to these kind of movements. The rest of the notes are optional but all are correct notes for D chord.

Then you could step it up some more
1/---------2----------3---------5---------7--------5---------3-----------2------------
2/----------3----------5--------7---------8---------7---------5-----------3----------
3/----------2------------------------------------------------------------------2------------
4/-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
5/-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
6/-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here your just walking it up a little further, then right back down to D. This could/would all happen while song is staying on D.
So you and bud usually just strum pretty easy songs. While (s)he's justing sittin there struming a D chord, throw that in. They'll go "man where did that come from"?Play around and find different ways to use them. It won't come overnite but these aren't too hard and if you keep incorporating them a little peice at a time, you can start using them pretty darn quickly. There's much more. As long as someone says they are intersted AND practicing this stuff I'll keep on, like ideas of what to do when this simple D song changes to G chord, then A chord. The 3rds on 2nd and 3rd strings, 3rd and 4th strings. How you can add notes to these easily. (after all you've got 2 free fingers there ready for duty) ect I'll skip the theory aspect for now but to say these can be thought of as little pieces of chords. If you go back and look at what chords make up what keys you'll see the pattern goes Maj min min MAJ MAJ min then (b3 b5), Oh hell I'll go ahead and show this.
Your taking the open D shape chord and and walking the scale up the neck using  D chord shapes, changing it to a Dm shape chord where appropriate and only using the note on 1 and 2nd string, which happens to be the I and III of the chord. (hence 3rds) Heres the same thing I put up in first diagram showing the whole chord with other note in shape included in ( ) This () note is the 5th
Remember chords in key M m m M M m (b5b7)
              I D maj       II Em         III F#min       IV GMaj          V A Maj            VI Bmin         VII  C#b5b3   
1/------------2--------------3-------------5-------------7----------------9----------------10---------------12--
2/------------3--------------5-------------7-------------8---------------10---------------12---------------14-
3/------------(2)----------(4)-----------(6)-----------(7)-------------(9)--------------(11)-------------12--
4/--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
5/-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
6/-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The 3rd string is the 5th of your triad, the 2nd string the 1 and the first string the 3rd. If you want, check this out. Play the scale up the neck like this and use entire chord. It'll make earier post about what chords work in a key clearer. Remember the shapes are all either an open D shape or Open Dm shape (except VII) just moved up the neck. Well I suppose that's a bit to keep someone busy a while. This is good stuff. Sensibud of tips. highly recommended.

For mandolin, these same types of things are GREAT.
Same idea. 1 is on the 1st string this time though and 3rd on the 2nd string(s)
This would be working out of a G chord

    G chord
----------3------------5--------------7--------------8------------10------------12-------------14-----
----------2------------3---------------5-------------7-------------9-------------10--------------12---
----------5-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you play mandolin  you know that since the strings are all tuned the same interval from each other, you can simply move
chord  shape over a string and use same shape so you can  do same thing 3rds wise on 2nd and 3rd string using C shape.
    C chord
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------3------------5--------------7--------------8------------10------------12-------------14------
----------2------------3---------------5-------------7-------------9-------------10--------------12----
----------5--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
anywhere you use that chord shape, the same 3rd pattern will apply above it.

That was a fantastic post!  I  read it in its entirety, and  I'm eager to practice what you put down there.  I very much appreciated your "ramblings" leading into the exercise, because yeah, the first year of guitar is daunting.  Chord changes, daunting.  Maintaining rhythm, daunting.  Good to hear from someone who has conquered the slowness of learning.  I consider myself in the slow and steady camp of learners, maybe with an emphasis on slow.  Keeps me inspired to hear from those who maybe didn't have the gift of musical prowess right out of the gate, but had  the dedication to keep at it.  And to know that there are breakthroughs if you do so.

I played through everything you detailed there and will incorporate it into daily practice.   Posts like yours take a lot of time to write, so I really appreciate your doing it.  Really helpful.

Very cool! As long as 1 person is actually working on this, and lets me know, I'll keep on. Ryler, keep this in the back of your mind. Don't kill yourself with the theory right now if it doesn't click but keep nibbling at it.
Eventually when you understand the 3rds well, it will lead you to knowing chords all over the neck. That may be 2,3,5 years from now. Hopefully not cause I bore that cross already and can help speed it along. But plant that seed. More on how/why that's gonna happen later. I went back and corrected the overlapping lines. What you put in post can get convaluted when it actually goes to thread.
Please if you have any questions, ask them. Make me think more. The more I write these down the more they concrete up in my head.

Moving this discussion over to new thread called "using 3rd's and beyond.
Please continue to use this thread for cool chords, or one off little tips. thanks!