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Author Topic: Dealing with people who feel entitled to play your guitar?  (Read 2164 times)
Paraclete
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« Reply #20 on: March 07, 2018, 03:28:11 AM »

I once had a player who was asked to sit in on one song by the other guitar player in the band,though I didn't want to every one said he cool.Well he was cool until he walked off stage and handed me back my guitar and said the guitar was a pice of "pig s**t".I told him if he ever wants to sit in with us again to bring his own guitar and amp.I told the other guitar player what he said over the mic and next time he should give up his guitar.The people in there sit's and the rest of the band were shocked.I no longer allow anyone play my guitars or sit in.If they ask all I have to say now is "i use 14-58's and I don't think they can handle it".Most get scare off by the gauge of strings any way.
If someone come's close to my guitars I stop them on the spot and give my best look of "touch and die".

Ha!  Love the gauge thing!  Anyone who calls your guitar a piece of pig s**t to your face can just go jump off a cliff.  What an arrogant a**!
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2010 LSV-11e
2002 4E Jose Ramirez
1998 S6+folk Seagull
1986 Charvel Model 3A
2001 Fender Jazz bass
1935 A-OO Gibson mandolin
1815 JG Hamm violin
Paraclete
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« Reply #21 on: March 07, 2018, 03:33:46 AM »

Tough situation to be in, no doubt. On one hand, I love sharing my guitars, and particularly my Larrivees, but with considerations. The person has to possess the wherewithal to appreciate the guitar and the circumstances. If I don't feel they understand what's going on, and I'd guess this group knows what I mean by that, then it either becomes a polite refusal or a risk we may or may not be willing to take. Just because someone can strum a few cowboy chords doesn't mean they truly appreciate the beauty and nature of the instrument. And similarly, I've known excellent players whom I wouldn't let near my guitars for fear of damage by their heavy technique.
I was asked by a complete stranger if he could play my pretty new at the time Larrivee LV with IAS top. It was at a public in-the-park weekly jam. There were a lot of people watching and this guy pops up off his blanket where he was watching with his wife and young kids and asks to play a song for his wife using my guitar. He made a lot of promises and claimed to understand the circumstances. I made him one promise...that if I felt he was abusing my guitar in any way I would stop his song and most likely embarrass the heck out of him. He did really well! He also loved his first opportunity to play a Larrivee.  
Now, having said all that, entitlement, as in your situation, is a whole 'nother story. I'd've just said "no, sorry but it's still too new and I don't let others play it", or something of the sort. If it's looking like the kid (and mom) might be an ongoing presence, maybe having a cheap backup church guitar might help the kid out.   

Sigh...the girl just turned 18, and her parents promised to buy her a nice guitar for her birthday.  After seeing the Larrivées we have onstage (all three of which are custom or special) they looked into them and realized it was way out of their price range.  So they have an inkling of what an LSV-11 might be worth.  I think the mom just has no boundaries or wants to give her kid a chance to play a really nice guitar.  The mom is only a subsititute bass player at this point....and only because I have chosen to play acoustic and violin instead of bass.  Kid has a guitar.  But it doesn’t hold a candle to a Larrivée.
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2010 LSV-11e
2002 4E Jose Ramirez
1998 S6+folk Seagull
1986 Charvel Model 3A
2001 Fender Jazz bass
1935 A-OO Gibson mandolin
1815 JG Hamm violin
Paraclete
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« Reply #22 on: March 07, 2018, 03:35:36 AM »

Hi Paraclete,

When the answer is "No", the reason doesn't matter.

When people ask, I reply "No, I don't do that."  While "I don't do that" is unnecessary and redundant, it is emphatic and correctly conveys that I'm not open to discussion.

Given the context where this situation arose for you, this shouldn't be a difficult concept.

Yes, thank you for that.  All these response are the encouragement I need to simply put my foot down and not worry about feelings. 



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2010 LSV-11e
2002 4E Jose Ramirez
1998 S6+folk Seagull
1986 Charvel Model 3A
2001 Fender Jazz bass
1935 A-OO Gibson mandolin
1815 JG Hamm violin
Paraclete
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« Reply #23 on: March 07, 2018, 03:41:28 AM »

The only 2 dings my JCL 40th Anniversary Edition has came from a guy who borrowed it on stage and bumped into a microphone stand.  It was almost new at the time and even though they are small, they are on the front on that beautiful spruce top.  I haven’t let it bother me too much.  These days I use both the JCL and my Goodall on stage on Sundays.  I do let others play them but it doesn’t happen too often.  I think it is the biblical concept of stewardship: Take care of and use the talents and gifts God has given to us.  And also remember they really belong to him....

Yeah, and that’s where my inner battle comes in.... be a team player and be gracious because to do otherwise comes off as selfish and rude, or stand up for my rights as a musician and person who dropped more money than I could really even afford at the time on a dream guitar.  I’m not hung up on material things, but I also don’t think that gives other people a right to step on my toes.  My other option is to go back to playing my Seagull.  I shouldn’t have to choose.  But it really comes down to dealing with someone who didn’t even bother to ask permission.  She just felt she had the right to hand my guitar to her kid because she wanted me to play the cajon instead....and she is not a regular part of the band in the first place.
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2010 LSV-11e
2002 4E Jose Ramirez
1998 S6+folk Seagull
1986 Charvel Model 3A
2001 Fender Jazz bass
1935 A-OO Gibson mandolin
1815 JG Hamm violin
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« Reply #24 on: March 07, 2018, 04:13:44 AM »

Hi Paraclete,



Yeah, and that’s where my inner battle comes in.... be a team player and be gracious because to do otherwise comes off as selfish and rude, or stand up for my rights

This feels like an exploration of extremes.

Do you have to be willing to share your possessions to be a team player?

Would you be judged so harshly? And even if you were, would it matter?

Quote
as a musician and person who dropped more money than I could really even afford at the time on a dream guitar.  I’m not hung up on material things, but I also don’t think that gives other people a right to step on my toes.
 

This isn't about the money and I encourage you not to make yourself crazy over that point.

It's about: The guitar (any guitar) is your property. You get to decide who will play it.

Quote
My other option is to go back to playing my Seagull.  I shouldn’t have to choose.  But it really comes down to dealing with someone who didn’t even bother to ask permission.  She just felt she had the right to hand my guitar to her kid because she wanted me to play the cajon instead....and she is not a regular part of the band in the first place.

I would talk to the mother, discreetly and without apology. Simply state that handling your guitars is not appropriate. I would be surprised if she asked why, but if she did, my answer would be, "because it's my guitar".

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« Reply #25 on: March 07, 2018, 04:26:06 AM »

Hi Paraclete,

A little more...

I used to host open mic shows and foster community music in various settings. I still do, but I had an epiphany one day. I was walking around a music store and trying out instruments with a mind to buy yet another guitar for other people to play.

I walked out of the store empty-handed, sold or donated all the instruments that I was dragging to shows for others to play.

Now I advertise: Bring your own instrument.

I don't want to put you on the spot - so don't answer, but consider: Would it be easier to donate the Seagull to the church?




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Queequeg
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« Reply #26 on: March 07, 2018, 02:42:52 PM »

I'd do my best southern drawl (which ain't very good, truth-be-told).
"beggin' your pardon, ma'am. but that one don't get passed around here."
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flatlander
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« Reply #27 on: March 07, 2018, 03:11:20 PM »

I have some friends I let play my guitars.  No one else.  I just say, I am sorry, but my guitars are not lenders.  If they don’t like it, well, they are my guitars and I have pretty thick skin.
Most of your guitars are works of art. I'd do the same.
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Paraclete
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« Reply #28 on: March 07, 2018, 03:43:37 PM »

Hi Paraclete,



This feels like an exploration of extremes.

Do you have to be willing to share your possessions to be a team player?

Would you be judged so harshly? And even if you were, would it matter?

It kind of is...extremes.  It’s the church aspect that is tripping me up.  This is kind of why I posted this, because I need the reality check and maybe the encouragement (or the kick in the pants) to stop thinking that way.  For the most part, the guys in the band would back me up, but there always the “stop making a scene” thing.  Sometimes it is difficult to be a female instrumentalist.   Like it or not, I do get treated differently....and not by the guys.  And you are right....it doesn’t matter.  I’m a permanent member of the band, not a sit-in.
  

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2010 LSV-11e
2002 4E Jose Ramirez
1998 S6+folk Seagull
1986 Charvel Model 3A
2001 Fender Jazz bass
1935 A-OO Gibson mandolin
1815 JG Hamm violin
Paraclete
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« Reply #29 on: March 07, 2018, 03:49:02 PM »

Hi Paraclete,

A little more...

I used to host open mic shows and foster community music in various settings. I still do, but I had an epiphany one day. I was walking around a music store and trying out instruments with a mind to buy yet another guitar for other people to play.

I walked out of the store empty-handed, sold or donated all the instruments that I was dragging to shows for others to play.

Now I advertise: Bring your own instrument.

I don't want to put you on the spot - so don't answer, but consider: Would it be easier to donate the Seagull to the church?






I think I will answer it though.  This kid has her own guitar.  Church doesnt need my Seagull.  Generally speaking, it is expected that you provide your own instruments, unless you are playing piano or drums.  I don’t think I’ve ever been to an open mic where instruments are provided!  Thanks for responding and helping me get my priorities straight.
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2010 LSV-11e
2002 4E Jose Ramirez
1998 S6+folk Seagull
1986 Charvel Model 3A
2001 Fender Jazz bass
1935 A-OO Gibson mandolin
1815 JG Hamm violin
Paraclete
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« Reply #30 on: March 07, 2018, 03:51:15 PM »

I have some friends I let play my guitars.  No one else.  I just say, I am sorry, but my guitars are not lenders.  If they don’t like it, well, they are my guitars and I have pretty thick skin.

Considering the guitars (and ukulele) that you have, I think a lot of us would be intimidated at the very thought of being given permission to even hold one of those masterpieces!
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2010 LSV-11e
2002 4E Jose Ramirez
1998 S6+folk Seagull
1986 Charvel Model 3A
2001 Fender Jazz bass
1935 A-OO Gibson mandolin
1815 JG Hamm violin
Paraclete
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« Reply #31 on: March 07, 2018, 03:54:30 PM »

I'd do my best southern drawl (which ain't very good, truth-be-told).
"beggin' your pardon, ma'am. but that one don't get passed around here."

LOL!  We’s so close to the northern border that I think I’d need to do the Canadian version instead....something like  “sworry....”
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2010 LSV-11e
2002 4E Jose Ramirez
1998 S6+folk Seagull
1986 Charvel Model 3A
2001 Fender Jazz bass
1935 A-OO Gibson mandolin
1815 JG Hamm violin
Queequeg
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« Reply #32 on: March 07, 2018, 06:21:33 PM »

LOL!  We’s so close to the northern border that I think I’d need to do the Canadian version instead....something like  “sworry....”
I'm less than an hour from the CA border, and that's the only way I could pull off an accent like that.
No Southerner worth her salt would fall for my bogus drawl.
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flatlander
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« Reply #33 on: March 08, 2018, 02:39:35 PM »

I'm less than an hour from the CA border, and that's the only way I could pull off an accent like that.
No Southerner worth her salt would fall for my bogus drawl.
Ha. Yea Quee you could work on the actual saying too. I could rip out a few but I keep thinking they may be taken as inappropriate for here. :)
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10-1614 more than a number, it's body and soul.
Walkerman
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« Reply #34 on: March 08, 2018, 05:48:09 PM »

One time, I had a guitar being set up by Tracy Longo .... he is sort of a local legend, does guitar work for Chris Hillman and the like.
When I got it back, he mentioned that John Jorgensen had seen it and asked to play it.  He hopes I didn’t mind.  The only thing I minded was that I did not get to hear him play it.  Sometimes rules are meant to be broken.
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flatlander
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« Reply #35 on: March 08, 2018, 06:34:14 PM »

One time, I had a guitar being set up by Tracy Longo .... he is sort of a local legend, does guitar work for Chris Hillman and the like.
When I got it back, he mentioned that John Jorgensen at seen it and asked to play it.  He hopes I didn’t mind.  The only thing I minded was that I did not get to hear him play it.  Sometimes rules are meant to be broken.
That's called putting mojo in guitar! I'm lucky to know Thumbs Carllile's widow. She dug Thumb's Black tele out of closet when I asked about it and I played it a bit. It was originally George Harrison's. George gave it to Delaney Bramlett who in turn gave it to Thumbs. I was trying to suck some mojo from it. Didn't work that well as far as improving my playing, but it was an honor and just plain cool to have in my hands. J.J. would be the same. It usually ends up that I'll offer someone to play my guitar because most decent and thoughtful players won't just jump up and asked to play it. They'll just ask questions about it, obviously interested. I'll ask if they play, get a feel, and say "here, check it out".  If I'm playing and a stranger comes up and says something like "hey man, let me check out your guitar"....not. You shouldn't be shy about saying no. Even at church. They'll get over it and if they don't, that's their problem. They should be more respectful.
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10-1614 more than a number, it's body and soul.
Queequeg
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« Reply #36 on: March 08, 2018, 09:32:46 PM »

One night several years ago my job was to drive Roger McGuinn and his wife to and from the gig, wipe down his Rickenbacker 360 12-string after the show and place it back in its case and load it into my car.
Holding that Rick was like holding a piece of RnR history in my hands, thinking this right here is the reason I bought a Rickenbacker decades before.
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divertis
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« Reply #37 on: March 08, 2018, 10:04:52 PM »

I have no problem lending my car to other people, but I do have one lending my guitars to newbies or people not knowing to handle an instrument properly. Whenever I feel there can be such danger, I bring on a second guitar, good one but less expensive and already beat up. Have fun guys, my Larri is resting in the hard case!


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Walkerman
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« Reply #38 on: March 09, 2018, 01:20:55 AM »

I have no problem lending my car to other people, but I do have one lending my guitars to newbies or people not knowing to handle an instrument properly. Whenever I feel there can be such danger, I bring on a second guitar, good one but less expensive and already beat up. Have fun guys, my Larri is resting in the hard case!


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When I am not playing my guitars they are in their cases, in a closet out of sight
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mike in lytle
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« Reply #39 on: March 09, 2018, 02:42:14 AM »

When I am not playing my guitars they are in their cases, in a closet out of sight

When I am not playing my guitars they are in the (deleted) furthest down the (deleted) from the (deleted) to the house. Mostly they are on the (deleted), sitting on (deleted) or on the (deleted) also on stands, unless it is too humid or dry then they are (phrase deleted).
If someone comes to the house the door to that room is (deleted) and (deleted). The only remaining evidence to me being a musician is a (deleted) in the living room. I usually get a "oh you are a (deleted), and I reply, "well I used to be".
Mike
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