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Author Topic: Neck Radius Change ???  (Read 1733 times)
AZLiberty
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« on: January 12, 2018, 07:03:04 PM »


Folks on the AGF are reporting that Larrivee has changed from the compound radius to a straight 16" radius.

That's a rather massive change (and downgrade) if true.   Can anyone confirm?

Mark
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« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2018, 07:32:25 PM »

The Thalia capo guys have a chart:



What was it before it was 16" Compound?
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« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2018, 07:34:45 PM »

John Jr. posted confirmation in another thread, I think in the Thalia capo thread.  I guess they changed as of October 2017
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« Reply #3 on: January 12, 2018, 09:02:04 PM »

Disappointing.  Wonder what prompted the change.

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« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2018, 10:54:14 PM »

Disappointing.  Wonder what prompted the change.



Pairing with Thalia?

Ed
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Paraclete
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« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2018, 12:47:31 AM »

Disappointing.  Wonder what prompted the change.



I hear a lot of people mention (at least on the AGF) that they don’t care for the flat radius.  I wonder if it is a concession to that.  I’m disappointed.  The compound radius is one of the things I really really like about Larrivée and why I invested in one.  My friend’s C-10 was the first acoustic I played that actually felt really comfortable to my fretting hand. (Yes, I come from a classical background.  Even my electric guitar has a very flat radius).
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« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2018, 01:29:19 AM »


  For absolute clarity....
 
  - Up until October 1st 2017 • All Larrivée's are compound radius from 16° at the nut, down to 21° at the last fret
  - Post October 1st 2017 • All Larrivée's are no longer compounded and are now built 16° straight the from nut to last fret


 

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AZLiberty
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« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2018, 02:13:58 AM »

Rainsong's radius is 20"  (not compound) and nobody complains that Rainsong is too flat, and yet somehow Larrivee's 16 tapered to 20/21 is?

Just another concession to be "more like Martin" I guess.  Just like the ugly Martin style pickguards they started using a few years ago. 

Another reason to buy used I guess.  

This really encourages me to make my next new guitar a Tinker.   Ed bought a bunch of equipment and tooling from the old Vancouver factory and builds his guitars with the same compound radius because he is using the old Larrivee jigs.
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« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2018, 08:35:20 PM »

I'm guessing because a straight radius requires less work on the frets.  You can run a block straight over them and not worry about the compound radius. I don't mind either 16 or 20, but I thought the compound was one of those little quality things that made Larrivee special. They certainly did play nicer because of it.
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« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2018, 10:10:21 PM »

Rainsong's radius is 20"  (not compound) and nobody complains that Rainsong is too flat, and yet somehow Larrivee's 16 tapered to 20/21 is?

Just another concession to be "more like Martin" I guess.  Just like the ugly Martin style pickguards they started using a few years ago. 

Another reason to buy used I guess.  


I just can't imagine JCL making concessions to anyone. But what do I know.
If someone wants a guitar that's like a Martin, why not buy a Martin? There's plenty of them.
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« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2018, 11:32:26 PM »

I just can't imagine JCL making concessions to anyone. But what do I know.
If someone wants a guitar that's like a Martin, why not buy a Martin? There's plenty of them.

Everyone is trying to read the market and find new customers in new market niches.

Martin just revamped many of their standard models and gave them all the same "Modern Low Oval" neck - which has ticked off purists who like a larger neck, or a neck with some (or a lot of) "V" in it's shape. So I guess Martin is going after the Taylor customers, and Larrivee is going after the Martin customers, and Taylor has revamped their guitars to try to warm up the sound - so they're going after the Martin customers.  Still with me?

So if Larrivee is trying to widen their appeal, more power to them. I didn't like the addition of Martin style pickguards (especially on L, LV and C bodies), and I really like the old traditional marquetry rosette. But I'm already in the camp, so Larrivee doesn't have to convince/sell me!

As was said on another brand's webpage, there are plenty of used guitars that have the specs many people want, and there's a custom shop... don't know if you can get Larrivee to build you a custom with a compound radius fretboard, but it doesn't hurt to ask...
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AZLiberty
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« Reply #11 on: January 15, 2018, 03:18:21 AM »

don't know if you can get Larrivee to build you a custom with a compound radius fretboard, but it doesn't hurt to ask...


Walnut/Cedar Forum Guitar with the compound radius fretboard.  Ship with the pickguard uninstalled like we did with the III and  IV?

Um...hypothetically of course.  bigrin
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« Reply #12 on: January 15, 2018, 03:20:00 AM »

Let's get beyond the "concessions" thing.  Of course they conform to what the market wants.  The 40 series is the biggest thing to happen to Larrivee in a long time.  How about all those electrics they made when the acoustic market was dead?  JCL is running a business.  Concessions must be made.  Doesn't mean the company is any less great.
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« Reply #13 on: January 15, 2018, 04:01:32 AM »

 Doesn't mean the company is any less great.

Correct.  It simply means that the instruments are less desirable.   (at least to some)
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« Reply #14 on: January 15, 2018, 05:00:43 AM »

Let's get beyond the "concessions" thing.  Of course they conform to what the market wants.  

Or maybe, Jean (and crew) are making what they want to make.

Ed
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« Reply #15 on: January 15, 2018, 08:11:20 PM »

Or maybe, Jean (and crew) are making what they want to make.

Ed

They already said the pickguard thing was market driven, as well as the fret change, which was based on feedback they got.  I don't know why people are so bothered by the idea that there are compromises but if you want to think these guitar's are just JCL's ultimate expressions of his craft and the changes have nothing to do with making money, I'll just politely disagree.
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« Reply #16 on: February 09, 2018, 07:14:57 AM »

The change doesn't make a difference to me - the compound radius combined with my playing style (and where I spend most of my playing time) is hardly noticeable on my 12 fret 00-40 anyway.

Putting this in perspective:

Vintage Fender (Strats)'s fret boards were specced at 7 1/4"  and changed to 9 1/2" in the 1980s because of a fretting-out (Choking of notes played when bending strings) problem found by players on the former.
Naturally this is more problematic on electrics than acoustics relatively speaking because of electric players using way lighter strings that bend easier and further.

The compound radius was meant to prevent fretting out at the top registers. At the same time flatter fret boards are more difficult to play barre-chords than radiussed ones.
If anyone can prove that a 16" fret board frets out, then I would agree we have an argument.

Most of us use at least light gauge strings (012"-052") which can't be bent to the extent ultra light gauge (0.009"- 0.045") can (which would sound ridiculous on a Larrivee acoustic anyway).

I honestly don't think the Larrivee family would have taken this decision to change to 16" radius lightly.
I would also be very interested to know what players like Tommy Emmanuel (who loves Larrivees) think of it - perhaps top players were consulted and the change was motivated by consensus from the industry?

For what it is worth, my Gibson LG-2 (12" radius) doesn't fret out with light gauge strings anywhere on the fret board and it is quite comfy to play.
My 16" custom Thompson is a good compromise and very comfy too.
 
So what's to gain from this? - No fretting out (for those who bend strings to the extreme and not applicable to me) and easier barring of chords - sounds cool to me.
I for one welcome the change...
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« Reply #17 on: February 10, 2018, 02:30:59 PM »

Weren’t the fret boards on early Larrivee steel strings flat, like a classical?

I seem to remeber playing one of the first parlours and if there was a radius, it was so big that it was effectively absent.

Looking forward to trying one of these - maybe it isn’’t flatness I’m looking for but lack of change up and down the neck.
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J M Larrivée
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« Reply #18 on: February 10, 2018, 06:33:54 PM »


  The move was driven by the players. For years, the overwhelming response to switch to a straight 16° radius caught up to us. Larrivée can appreciate the love some of our players have for the compound radius. For this reason, it will likely remain an off-catalog custom option.
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DaveyO
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« Reply #19 on: February 10, 2018, 10:22:42 PM »

I really love my Larrivee,but a
The neck is just a tad wide ,I look forward to
The new neck design
David
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