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Author Topic: F-III bridge plate + K&K mini different?  (Read 8094 times)
Mr_LV19E
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« Reply #60 on: February 23, 2010, 10:18:30 PM »

The front edge of the Larrivee plate is about even with the saddle position.
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« Reply #61 on: February 25, 2010, 09:16:44 PM »

While it may not be optimal, has anyone tried a set of K&K behind the bridge pins of their FIII instead?

Yes, that is exactly what I did. The amplified sound is a bit boxy. I've tweaked the sound with the Pure XLR preamp and it is acceptable, but not the best it could be. It's still better than a UST
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« Reply #62 on: February 26, 2010, 01:35:31 AM »

Could it be that the bridge plate is correct for the guitar and maybe they weren't thinking about what type of pickup was going to be installed afterwards?Its not like they designed acoustic guitars to be electricified.

I just looked at my Original Forum OM,  and the bridge plate and pin holes look the same as on my F-III.
I think unclrob is correct,  this is where Larrivee wants the bridge plates on these 12 frets.
No one seems to complain about the quality of the response, sustain or overall sound with this bridge plate placement.

Forum IV  =  12 fret......hmmm  maybe same placement coming on those also.

just my 2 cents worth......barely    
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« Reply #63 on: February 26, 2010, 01:52:49 AM »


Forum IV  =  12 fret......hmmm  maybe same placement coming on those also.


The spruce top "special edition" bridgeplate is properly placed.  That is to say, it is where they usually are.  And, FWIW, a K&K goes on just fine. 

I'll try to get a photo.

Ed
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Barefoot Rob
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« Reply #64 on: February 26, 2010, 03:27:13 AM »

I checked my OM03PA and its in the same place as the forum.
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« Reply #65 on: February 28, 2010, 12:59:35 AM »


Got the bridge plate extension from Jim in the mail today, glued it in place and the guitar is hanging on the wall of my music room.  Tomorrow I will install the K&K.


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« Reply #66 on: February 28, 2010, 01:44:05 AM »

  That is some clean work. I wouldn't dare show you my bridge extension on the Maple/Koa.
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« Reply #67 on: February 28, 2010, 02:36:32 AM »

Let us know if there are any volumn or tonal changes.
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« Reply #68 on: February 28, 2010, 04:05:52 AM »

Let us know if there are any volumn or tonal changes.

I will. I'm hoping because of the close proximity of the brace that it will have little impact.
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« Reply #69 on: February 28, 2010, 08:16:46 PM »

Okay, it is installed.
Didn't notice any change in tone or volume playing unplugged.
Plugged directly to my amp this passive PUP is louder than my active PUP on my LV. I started playing and my wife said from the other room, "that is the nicest sound i've heard since you started playing, how come you didn't put that pickup in a long time ago?"  

Really though, this pickup sounds so balanced with no harshness at all. Can't stay here to long because my wife wants to jam   but here are a few more pic's.
First one is a workbench shot, second shows the bracing and you can see the extension from outside the guitar and the third shows the final pickup position.




Here are a couple shots of the jack install inside and out.



I will make some changes in the installation method next time I put one of these in.
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« Reply #70 on: March 01, 2010, 03:20:30 AM »

Well done, and also very good pics.

How you did the pics, especially the 'glow thru' brace showing one, would make a good separate thread.

Glad it sounds good too.  Dont ya love it when a good plan comes together and works....

tks 4 sharing... 
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« Reply #71 on: March 01, 2010, 06:47:17 AM »

Love the D'Addario colored ball ends in the installed pic.
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« Reply #72 on: March 01, 2010, 08:21:56 AM »

Roger, nice looking installation.
You remarked that Jim doesn't like th K&K - did he say which one he likes?
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« Reply #73 on: March 01, 2010, 10:45:26 AM »

Not to interfer with a directed question but Jim has done a couple K&K's for me and had mentioned the Baggs (I don't know which), but as I told him my guitars have the K&K and so do my son's. We just prefer the sound, have the pre's and he did a great job. I don't know that he doesn't like them, he may just have a preference for the Baggs.
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« Reply #74 on: March 01, 2010, 04:36:54 PM »

     Thanks for the positive replies.

I don't remember the specifics regarding Jim's opinion of the K&K but this is the gist of it.
The way I remember it (this is where I have problems) Jim said he took a guitar in (I believe he said it was a Martin D28), he said the owner wanted the K&K pickup removed to put in another guitar. He said when trying to remove the transducers that they were damaged beyond repair and that he broke the top of the guitar. I think that would be enough for me to not want to try that job again.  I don't know how the top broke, but I can tell you it is not easy to get your arm in the sound hole to clean off the transducers after installation. That is one part I would change next time I do one of these, I used the supplied Dum Dum putty to hold the transducers to the piece of cardboard. You use so little that it doesn't seem like it would be an issue but when you press up on the cardboard the putty spreads and so does the stupid glue gel (they tell you to use a generous amount of glue, I think I know how much to use next time based on the amount that oozed out the edges). You just have to take your time and slowly scrape off what you can with your finger nails. 
The web site says to use a razor blade to slice under the transducers to remove them, well first of all when you put your arm through the sound hole your working blind, second you would have to come at them from the tail end of the top because of the x braces, I don't know about others but my arm only goes so far through the hole and I could just reach the bridge plate but being able to hold a razor blade (with handle) try to line it up with the PUP and get any leverage doesn't seem like a job I would enjoy. All guitars are different but the F-III being only 4" deep and the sound hole being a tad smaller in diameter is a bit limiting as far as access goes.
Jim's opinion of the K&K had nothing to do with its performance. And again the story may have been told a little differently (he's a busy guy so when I do call him I like to get down to business and not take up too much of his time).
I had to turn the volume down on my amp from 5 to 2 to get the same volume level as I get out of my B-Band PUP in the LV, I'm very happy with the sound. Plus, it doesn't matter what note or string that I play, they are all the same volume. No resonant frequencies that want to feedback.
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« Reply #75 on: March 01, 2010, 05:51:20 PM »

Roger repairpeople develope a soft area in there forearm so that it bends a little>
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« Reply #76 on: March 01, 2010, 07:56:51 PM »

  Roger on working blind in the soundhole; You can buy the expensive Stewmac mirror that folds and then opens inside to give you a broad view or remove a mirror from the casing on a car or truck rearview mirror or two. Most of those will be the right shape to fit in the hole. I used a dremel cutting wheel to open up the casing and get the mirror out.
  Or just go to the auto parts and buy the cut to fit mirror replacement material. You can get a fairly large sheet of it for less than $7, then cut it in strips 3" wide and place them inside.
   Then put a scraper of some kind (exacto, small gasket scrapers, etc.) on a bent tool handle and you can see where you are working by the mirror (and a small lite) your hand won't be in the way if you make the angle right on your "custom scraper".

      I have a craftsman specialized gasket scraper with 3 high quality steel blades that fit on a handle made for it. They can be made razor sharp and I have a cut to prove that. Anyway they have a hole in the middle and they have many angles and shapes between the three blades so they can be screwed on to other handles. A wooden back scrubber handle is one of the tool handles I use. It has an angle at the head and is made of good solid wood. But many other handles could be adapted. Dan Erliwine shows this technique in his book, only he uses tools sold by Stewmac quite a bit. Although sometimes he makes his own and shares how to do it yourself.
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« Reply #77 on: March 01, 2010, 09:16:45 PM »

With the K&K... 

You don't really need to put all that much pressure on the pickups when gluing them on...  if you are deforming the putty, you are putting more pressure on than necessary.  You just need to get the 2 surfaces (pickup with glue and bridgeplate) to make contact.   Then you need to hold it (again, LOW pressure) for a minute, then let it sit with no pressure for another minute (or 5).   Then it is plenty easy to remove the cardboard and putty dots. 

FWIW, I've installed several (uhm...  6 or 7) and never had a problem. 

I've gone through several of their "suggested methods", from wraping inverted scotchtape around my finger and using a pair of pins to feel the location to the current single element at a time with a jig.  What works best for me, is a all at once jig.  I still "dry fit" everything several times, until I'm sure of what is going to happen before I spread any super glue.  I've never removed one (never wanted to) but I've bought one that had been removed.  So it *is* possible.

There *is* a certain amount of blind work you need to do if you do anything inside a guitar. 

Ed
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Mr_LV19E
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« Reply #78 on: March 02, 2010, 12:53:42 AM »


How you did the pics, especially the 'glow thru' brace showing one, would make a good separate thread.


When I get the time I will do that.


Danny, I got a couple mirrors that I use. Thanks for the custom tool idea.

Ed, I'm sure I applied too much pressure but will take your advice on the next one. The all at once jig is the one I used. The one thing that I followed closely in the instructions was the part about installing the one pickup directly under the high E string, the other two between the G and D and the A and E.

Thanks for the tips.
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« Reply #79 on: March 02, 2010, 03:00:03 AM »

What did you use to secure the added piece of wood?
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