F-IV special order 00-03MT by the forum & Trinity Guitars

[shakey56]

Well, I'm in at #14...looking forward to it! cheers, Brian

[Mikeymac]

There's that Santa Cruz that tadol talked about way back in post #288.
http://www.elderly.com/new_instruments/items/SC1929.htm

Beautiful guitar, but out of my price range.

That Santa Cruz is nice, I'm sure, but it has no herringbone rosette, no maple body binding (looks like mahogany with black pinstripe binding)...it also is not a slot-head at a very "slot-head price," and it's a shorter scale (which would appeal to some, but not me, especially on this size body).  It would be very interesting to put it side by side with one of these Larrivee's (when they're built, of course) for a tone comparison.

For the extra $2K or so, you DO get the pyramid bridge!

Just sayin' ...

[01strat]

Thanks very much for your comments to my earlier question.  If I could bother you all for additional thoughts on another Q?

Do you think the F-IV will offer similar volume and tone to the Martin 00-15?  I played the 00-15 and it offers surprising volume.  I actually preferred the tone of the 00-15 to the 000-15 (both were 14 fret).   The Martin specs are little bit larger than the Larrivee 00 body specs.  

Martin 00-15 specs (14 fret, 24.9" scale length, lower bout 14 5/16", upper bout 10 7/8", body depth 4 1/8", 1 11/16" nut width)

I'm seriously considering the F-IV as I've never owned a 12 fret, but I'm on the fence with concerns about the tone and volume since no-one has played a 00-03MT or similar?  I'm guessing the tonal characteristics will be similar to the 00-50MT but the 50's have an enlarged sound hole that will be different than the 00-03MT?  (e.g.  50 offers increased volume, deeper, and richer tone?)

[BenF]

Thanks very much for your comments to my earlier question.  If I could bother you all for additional thoughts on another Q?

Do you think the F-IV will offer similar volume and tone to the Martin 00-15?  I played the 00-15 and it offers surprising volume.  I actually preferred the tone of the 00-15 to the 000-15 (both were 14 fret).   The Martin specs are little bit larger than the Larrivee 00 body specs.  

Martin 00-15 specs (14 fret, 24.9" scale length, lower bout 14 5/16", upper bout 10 7/8", body depth 4 1/8", 1 11/16" nut width)

I'm seriously considering the F-IV as I've never owned a 12 fret, but I'm on the fence with concerns about the tone and volume since no-one has played a 00-03MT or similar?  I'm guessing the tonal characteristics will be similar to the 00-50MT but the 50's have an enlarged sound hole that will be different than the 00-03MT?  (e.g.  50 offers increased volume, deeper, and richer tone?)

I suspect that if the 12 fret neck doesn't bother you from a playing perspective, then it will improve the tone and volume of the guitar over the 14 fret Martin.  My F-III is LOUD compared to my OM of a similar internal volume (no pun intended), and I put this down to the 12 fret design and bridge placement.

In terms of alternatives, a Guild M20 is an all hog guitar of a similar size, but 14 fret and short scale, so probably a little more thumpy and not as loud as either the Martin or the F-IV (I am speculating here).  The GAD M20 will set you back less than half of what the forum IV is, with a deluxe case, bone nut and saddle, gloss finish - a nice little guitar, but far eastern quality control dictates that you might get a cracker or you might get a dog.  It is a gamble that I will take in the future if a used F-IV doesn't come up when I can afford it.  Huss and Dalton do an OO with an all hog option, which is simply one of the most beautiful guitars i have ever seen.  It is knocking on the door of 4 x the price of the F-IV though.  It would be my first buy if I won the lotto.  Everyone has a lotto win guitar right?

If you have the $$$ ready to go, I think of all the suggestions, the F-IV will be the all round best deal, all things considered, in my opinion.  I agree with Danny, my F-III isn't a good guitar for the money, it is a good guitar period.  I basically swapped it for a new D-09 to make it work to the UK (customs, shipping etc. etc. etc.), and I wouldn't swap back in a million years.

[Danny]

Thanks very much for your comments to my earlier question.  If I could bother you all for additional thoughts on another Q?

Do you think the F-IV will offer similar volume and tone to the Martin 00-15?  I played the 00-15 and it offers surprising volume.  I actually preferred the tone of the 00-15 to the 000-15 (both were 14 fret).   The Martin specs are little bit larger than the Larrivee 00 body specs. 

Martin 00-15 specs (14 fret, 24.9" scale length, lower bout 14 5/16", upper bout 10 7/8", body depth 4 1/8", 1 11/16" nut width)

I'm seriously considering the F-IV as I've never owned a 12 fret, but I'm on the fence with concerns about the tone and volume since no-one has played a 00-03MT or similar?  I'm guessing the tonal characteristics will be similar to the 00-50MT but the 50's have an enlarged sound hole that will be different than the 00-03MT?  (e.g.  50 offers increased volume, deeper, and richer tone?)

I have owned a 00-09FM which was built to the same size specs as the F-IV will be. I loved the tone and volume from it. It was maple/spruce so some of the comparison is obviously not the same.
               I have also played the 15 series 000's and I'm pretty sure it was a 00-15 also. These have a modified bracing which to me stifles them compared to the Martin 1/4'' scalloped X bracing. I was not impressed with the tone or volume on the 15's, I know for sure the ones I tried were a 12 fret and a 14 fret, so I did play both those styles.
               I don't know if you would be happy with an F-IV. But at least as you can see by posts here, there will be some waiting in the wings later to buy one used.
      So it's your call. But I like the 00 Larri sound and can't wait to get mine.

[Danny]

"(I'm guessing the tonal characteristics will be similar to the 00-50MT but the 50's have an enlarged sound hole that will be different than the 00-03MT?  (e.g.  50 offers increased volume, deeper, and richer tone?)"

Oh, on this part I think the 00-03MT will be similar. It is a 12 fret and has less finish than a 00-50MT, so it will vibrate more freely on the back, sides and top.

      (And you could always get out your pocket knife on that sound hole)

[tikabear]

"I'm seriously considering the F-IV as I've never owned a 12 fret, but I'm on the fence with concerns about the tone and volume since no-one has played a 00-03MT or similar?  I'm guessing the tonal characteristics will be similar to the 00-50MT but the 50's have an enlarged sound hole that will be different than the 00-03MT?  (e.g.  50 offers increased volume, deeper, and richer tone?"

I'd have the same concerns about the tone and volume of a 00 because I like deep, full sounding guitars.  However, the comfort of a small guitar is tough to beat.  I have a Forum II mahogany top OM, 12 fret.  It is almost as loud as my L03R but it's had about 3 years to open up.  I don't think I'd ever sell it because it sounds so much bigger than it is and plays so well (I admit i'm gassing for that C09 at Galaxy Music).  I'm sure the larger dimensions help with the tone being so full but I also believe that the bridge placement in the middle of the sound board on a 12 fret improves the tone and volume.  I've played a 00 17 Martin and other Larrive OM's in 14 fret that didn't have the fullness my OM has.

[teh]

Tikabear: I don't think the small body is going to give you a big sound but it will give you a balanced sound that will be hard to beat for fingerstyle. If you want big sound, you can always amplify or mike it.

In my opinion the F-IV guitar is the modern day version of the Martin 00-17. Those who buy one will probably be glad they did. I have a 12 fret parlor that scratches my small guitar itch but if I didn't have it, I would be all over this model. I wouldn't try to compare the parlor to my dread or OM (Both Martins) or anything else I have played.

Think about it: Between 1930 and 1960, Martin made 13,360 model 00-17 guitars (All mahogany w/ simple appointments.) Source: The Martin Book by Walter Carter. I saw one of these for sale for $2,500 a few weeks ago and this model sold for $35 in 1930 and $105 in 1960. Source: Martin Guitars: A History by Mike Longworth. Most of the ones I have seen for sale look to be well played. I love my Martins but the price of their parlors and comparable models are pretty steep.

While the Santa Cruz is nice, it has a price tag to match. In the end, the F-IV will prove to be one of the best values to come down the pike in a long time.

[Danny]

Well said TEH.

[tikabear]

"Tikabear: I don't think the small body is going to give you a big sound but it will give you a balanced sound that will be hard to beat for fingerstyle."

My point exactly.  I was simply addressing 01strat's concerns about tone and volume.  I like the big, full sound I get from my L03R and my Forum II has nearly the same volume and fullness even though it is smaller.  No one can be completely certain about how the 00 will sound until it's played but I expect it will be fuller and louder due to the fact that it's a 12 fret. 

[AZLiberty]

I don't think the small body is going to give you a big sound but it will give you a balanced sound that will be hard to beat for fingerstyle. If you want big sound, you can always amplify or mike it.

My concern is actually that the mahogany top will be too stiff for a good fingerstyle guitar.  Most of the 'hog toped guitars I;ve interacted with only really sounded good played with a pick.

[prof_stack]

My concern is actually that the mahogany top will be too stiff for a good fingerstyle guitar.  Most of the 'hog toped guitars I;ve interacted with only really sounded good played with a pick.

Perhaps with thumbpick and fingerpicks and medium strings it will get moving!

[Danny]

 OK

[Mikeymac]

I don't want to sound like a nag, but having ordered one of these, I am interested in knowing (eventually) if it will have a one-piece neck, and what kind of case. Time frame isn't critical, but it seems by now Larrivee would know the rest of the specs on these, since over a dozen are confirmed ordered.

I know it's getting close to Christmas, and we're having blizzards in the midwest (two days off of school now for the kids), but I don't think it's snowing in Oxnard, and I'd be (pleasantly and happily) surprised if Larrivee was overrun with other orders in the midst of this booming economy. So why can't we find out these details?  I'm not blaming anyone, just asking if someone can do a little more investigating on our behalf.

Sorry, it's just me ... I've always been a "glass half empty" kind of guy... 

[Frank_S]

I don't want to sound like a nag, but having ordered one of these, I am interested in knowing (eventually) if it will have a one-piece neck, and what kind of case. Time frame isn't critical, but it seems by now Larrivee would know the rest of the specs on these, since over a dozen are confirmed ordered.

I know it's getting close to Christmas, and we're having blizzards in the midwest (two days off of school now for the kids), but I don't think it's snowing in Oxnard, and I'd be (pleasantly and happily) surprised if Larrivee was overrun with other orders in the midst of this booming economy. So why can't we find out these details?  I'm not blaming anyone, just asking if someone can do a little more investigating on our behalf.

Sorry, it's just me ... I've always been a "glass half empty" kind of guy... 

Maybe it's just us lefties that are that way because I'm curious too.   

[Danny]

I don't want to sound like a nag, but having ordered one of these, I am interested in knowing (eventually) if it will have a one-piece neck, and what kind of case. Time frame isn't critical, but it seems by now Larrivee would know the rest of the specs on these, since over a dozen are confirmed ordered.

I know it's getting close to Christmas, and we're having blizzards in the midwest (two days off of school now for the kids), but I don't think it's snowing in Oxnard, and I'd be (pleasantly and happily) surprised if Larrivee was overrun with other orders in the midst of this booming economy. So why can't we find out these details?  I'm not blaming anyone, just asking if someone can do a little more investigating on our behalf.

Sorry, it's just me ... I've always been a "glass half empty" kind of guy... 

I e-mailed Jim earlier today. I have not heard back yet.
  On the 3 piece neck, Jim has already said he expects it will be 3 piece. On the case he said expect the flat case and if we get an archtop case it will be and upgrade from Larrivee.
              If we get some answers I'll post em. I am curious also. But none of those issues are a deal breaker for me. The all S. American Mahogany 00MT was what I wanted. The rest is just stuff that will be nice if it goes our way, but no biggie if it doesn't.

[prof_stack]

Thanks Danny for the info on the neck.

I will assume, then, that the neck will be in 3-pieces.  That might be a deal breaker for me, and I have to think it out for another few days.

[Mikeymac]

  I e-mailed Jim earlier today. I have not heard back yet.
  On the 3 piece neck, Jim has already said he expects it will be 3 piece. On the case he said expect the flat case and if we get an archtop case it will be and upgrade from Larrivee.
              If we get some answers I'll post em. I am curious also. But none of those issues are a deal breaker for me. The all S. American Mahogany 00MT was what I wanted. The rest is just stuff that will be nice if it goes our way, but no biggie if it doesn't.

I agree, neither of those things is a deal breaker for me, either. I just thought by now we might hear the final details, that's all. Thanks for checking on it.

[Denis]

The all S. American Mahogany 00MT was what I wanted. The rest is just stuff that will be nice if it goes our way, but no biggie if it doesn't.

yup

[AZLiberty]

When did Larrivee start doing 3-piece necks?  (all mine are from the 90's and are one-piece)