Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: To strum or not to strum - Versatile guitars - reprise  (Read 1717 times)
Zohn
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2460




Ignore
« on: November 26, 2008, 07:17:06 AM »

This thread emanated from the "One trick pony OM" - thread posted elsewhere.

I think OM's are one trick ponies indeed - and designed to be that way. I have yet to see or hear discussions about people needing to strum for example a L-00, I guess that's because we need to start strumming somewhere, and the OM seems to be the obvious (or is it popular?) place to start.
Certain manufacturers provide more "Oomph" to their OM's though, like the Pre-war designs that seem to be the latest buzz, meaning more power, projection and a somewhat wider frequency response because of scalloped bracing, and shifting of the X-brace. Martin offer 'deep body' variations on one or two of their smaller guitars to accommodate more presence.
I also think that's where the evolution of Small Jumbos - others call them Grand Auditoriums emanated from. Typical characteristics of these designs provide more presence by a bigger top (foot print) and more string to string balance by the reduced depth. Others do a combination of enlarging the foot print somewhat, and the depth as well.
The 0000 or "M"-series from Martin, the famous J-185 from Gibson and the JOM from Dana Bourgeois (Jumbo OM). I believe this is the "versatile" category that most people refer to, and some claim it was started by Taylor (they were the first to call their 14-series Grand Auditoriums).
Well I salute you  bowdown Jean Larrivee for defining that spot in the market from the start with our beloved L-bodies, surely the ultimate in versatility!
Logged

"To me...music exists to elevate us as far as possible above everyday life." ~ Gabriel Faure
dougs
Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 50




Ignore
« Reply #1 on: December 10, 2008, 12:16:09 AM »

Amen
Logged
strawintogold
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1468


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #2 on: December 10, 2008, 12:49:36 AM »

I think this is all very silly. All guitars can be strummed or picked. Not all guitars can be strummed HARD and sound good. But, guess what, not everyone strums like a crazed moonshine saturated wannabe cowboy. No offense to cowboys intended. Technique, people, it matters.

You know before we had all this guitar 'stuff' people were known to do things like string wire from the corner of the roof to the ground and use that, cigar boxes, all kinds of stuff.

Is the guitar important? sure, but the player more so. I would also suggest that most people do not get an OM for strumming if that is their end all be all requirement. I also question the tact of declaring another's guitar to be inferior. Have you played an OM?

holly (who has many guitars who do many things)
Logged

"Needs more cowbell."

http://www.artfire.com/users/goatmountainarts
15% discount for Larrivee Forum Members (enter Larrivee coupon code at checkout)
 Handmade soap and stuff.
flatlander
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3782




Ignore
« Reply #3 on: December 10, 2008, 01:51:56 AM »

I have 3 quality acoustics. They cover the spectrum well enough where I don't jones for another. I find that the each have thier own qualities.
The 000-60 Would be my first choice for bare finger pickin. With a pick it can be too bright for my liking on regular down the neck open chords. Lets say camp fire songs. With bare fingers it still maintains a good ring. Does especially well at ringing out up the neck.
And the bass stands up well up the neck with bare thumb as well. I also like to strum it it up the neck with chords that have open notes ringing. It does something real special between 5th and 9th which is actually changing the way I play, gathering a collection of these open/up the neck chords.
 The Gallagher loves being strumed on the lower open chords. Rich, bassey, loud but mellow. Great for bluegrass. Leads up the neck
loud and clear. While it sounds good fingerpicked, it doesn't ring out like the 000. across the spectrum.
 If I had to make the painful decision of only have one guitar it would be the ole L.
I do think it's the most versitile. Anywhere and anyhow I play it, it sounds good. Struming/pickin big open chords it sounds great.
Strum up the neck or playing barres and 9ths up the neck great, very clear. Fingerpickin good. Single note lead loud and clear with a stinging vibrato for blues/boogie. I can strum it soft even down to a gentle brush or beat it like a crazed cowboy, or perhaps hillbilly would be more acurate, which I do with glee while trying to drive a boogie song or bluegrass sometimes. I don't even need the whiskey no mo. It can be a lady, or a truck drivin man. I actually think she is a man that's can be comfortable in all kinds of attire. (I'll stop here instead of 2 sentences back like I should have)
 Why have 3 guitars then? Well the L-10 was the only one (good acoustic) I had for well over 20 years for that reason.
But the 000-60 has it's nitch, actually 2 nitches, that it's great at. The Galleghers bass is loud but mellower than L's making it mellow in
good for bluegrass rythm, or just mellower and down homey in general. But the L does everything well, just a little bright for some flatpicking applications. That's my thoughts anyway, and know that I don't think anyone ever accused me of being Mr. Technique. bigrin
Logged

10-1614 more than a number, it's body and soul.
strawintogold
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1468


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #4 on: December 10, 2008, 02:05:14 AM »

Oh, I'm not saying anyone sucks. I haven't heard anyone play,lol. But, the limitations, I think, are placed squarely with the player, not the guitar.

holly
Logged

"Needs more cowbell."

http://www.artfire.com/users/goatmountainarts
15% discount for Larrivee Forum Members (enter Larrivee coupon code at checkout)
 Handmade soap and stuff.
flatlander
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3782




Ignore
« Reply #5 on: December 10, 2008, 02:12:44 AM »

I didn't take it like that and really wouldn't care if I did. I just think certain guitars do certain things better and an L does a lot of things well. My L will never sound like my Gallgher or vice versa even if I had the technique of Segovia. You have several guitars no?
Logged

10-1614 more than a number, it's body and soul.
strawintogold
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1468


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #6 on: December 10, 2008, 03:02:59 AM »

Let me rephrase a bit. I agree differant guitars do differant things better. What gets my back up is having my guitar called a 'One Trick Pony' which is a derogatory term. I guess I don't see the whole OM vs L pissing contest thing as something worthwhile. A lot of guitars do a lot of things well. I hardly think the OM is great at strumming and nothing else. in fact, I think it would be an odd choice for strumming and nought else.

I think it's fine to sing a guitars praises but unless one is, say, Sergovia, it's really cocky to declare one limited to strumming and another as superior in all things.

holly
Logged

"Needs more cowbell."

http://www.artfire.com/users/goatmountainarts
15% discount for Larrivee Forum Members (enter Larrivee coupon code at checkout)
 Handmade soap and stuff.
flatlander
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3782




Ignore
« Reply #7 on: December 10, 2008, 03:30:22 AM »

I don't know if cocky is the word I'd use but I agree with you there. I only played a Larrivee OM once for a short bit but yea. People
finger pick anywhere from soft to dang near pullin the strings off, with finger picks or not. I play each guitar differently pretty much instinctually to attempt to get the sound I want out of it. If a guitar has tone while strummed a good finger picker I would think could certainly get a good sound from it.
  I was comin more from the L being more versitile side of it, which is certainly my take on it. As in if I could have only one guitar. Since I play I variety of styles, albiet at jack of all trades, master of none level, to me L covers a wider range imo than most others. 
Logged

10-1614 more than a number, it's body and soul.
Zohn
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2460




Ignore
« Reply #8 on: December 10, 2008, 06:25:32 AM »

Let me rephrase a bit. I agree differant guitars do differant things better. What gets my back up is having my guitar called a 'One Trick Pony' which is a derogatory term. I guess I don't see the whole OM vs L pissing contest thing as something worthwhile. A lot of guitars do a lot of things well. I hardly think the OM is great at strumming and nothing else. in fact, I think it would be an odd choice for strumming and nought else.

I think it's fine to sing a guitars praises but unless one is, say, Sergovia, it's really cocky to declare one limited to strumming and another as superior in all things.

holly
Sounds like you have a most versatile Pony, good for you
Logged

"To me...music exists to elevate us as far as possible above everyday life." ~ Gabriel Faure
KenS
Senior Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 250




Ignore
« Reply #9 on: December 11, 2008, 03:55:18 PM »

A few points:

1.  Martin designed the OM in the 30's as a plectrum guitar.  It was designed for former jazz band banjo players who were moving to guitar and needed an instrument that could be heard above the band.  This, of course, was before the days of amplification.  The OM's status as a "fingerstyle guitar" is a recent development which probably began with Eric Schoenberg's workin the 70's/80's.  By the way - if it hadn't been for Eric's promotion of the style, you probably would have never heard of an OM.  It was only made from 1930-33 after which the 000 supplanted it.

2.  Peter Rowan is a flatpicker who uses a 000 guitar (same size as an OM).

3.  John Fahey's favorite size for fingerstyle was a dreadnought.

4.  The Rev. Gary Davis played a Gibson Jumbo.

Note: Fahey is credited with inventing modern American fingerstyle guitar - i.e. using tunings, venturing beyond the traditional playing of Hurt, Blake, Johnson, McGee, and the other early players.  Davis is one of the most important blues/rag fingerstyle players of the 20th century.

Ken
Logged
dougs
Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 50




Ignore
« Reply #10 on: December 26, 2008, 10:17:07 PM »

I'm no expert, but I have an OM-03 and a LV-03 and strum the heck out of both of them at times and to me there is very little difference. The LV does seem to handle it a wee bit better than the OM, but not by much.
Logged
danerada
Senior Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 316


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #11 on: December 26, 2008, 11:42:47 PM »

I play an OM and an L. i strum the heck out of both of them...sometimes like a "crazed moonshine saturated wannabe cowboy" :). There are also times when I play fingerstyle exclusively. i will pick either my L or my OM depending on the tone I want due to the body size/style and tonewoods...not whether I think one is meant for strumming and one isn't. To me I think it is just a matter of personal preference. Also - I think it has a lot to do with how I hold the pick as to what type of strumming sound I get. i guess what I am trying to say is while the guitar can have a distinct sound and may sound better on certain songs than others; I agree that it is the player that makes the difference in the end.

That being said. I think we should all own one of each of the different styles of guitars that Jean puts out (just to be safe)!!!!
Logged

Forum II # 8 of 10
Safricanplayer
Senior Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 287




Ignore
« Reply #12 on: December 29, 2008, 12:20:11 AM »

I think a great dreadnought might be the ultimate pony Certainly different body styles and wood combinations will lend themselves towards particular styles of playing, but my slope dred Mcknight covers everything from fingerstyle to flatpicking and rhythm work with aplomb.

I'm blessed to own it.   

   ~ Ray ~


[attachment deleted by admin]
Logged

Mcknight Slope Dred ~ '59 bearclaw Sitka / Wavy African Mahogany
Eichelbaum OM ~ Euro Spruce / Brazilian Rosewood
Martin 000-18 Norman Blake
Larrivee Forum III ~ All Hog
Zohn
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2460




Ignore
« Reply #13 on: December 29, 2008, 11:41:56 AM »

I think a great dreadnought might be the ultimate pony Certainly different body styles and wood combinations will lend themselves towards particular styles of playing, but my slope dred Mcknight covers everything from fingerstyle to flatpicking and rhythm work with aplomb.

I'm blessed to own it.   

   ~ Ray ~

Hey Boeta!! - a nice dread indeed, maybe I should relocate as well, some nice property for sale that you know of? 
Logged

"To me...music exists to elevate us as far as possible above everyday life." ~ Gabriel Faure
bluesman67
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3166




Ignore
« Reply #14 on: December 29, 2008, 01:47:13 PM »

I think my OM (Forum I) sounds terrific strumming at any level, crazy cowboy level, but it does need new strings.  After 2 weeks, it can't handle crazy cowboy strumming, it starts to sound broken and muddy.  D-03SP that I sold, it didin't matter how old the strings were.
Logged

bluesman67
HOGTOP CHARLOTTE

www.reverbnation.com/hogtopcharlotte
Safricanplayer
Senior Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 287




Ignore
« Reply #15 on: January 01, 2009, 02:18:32 AM »

Hey Boeta!! - a nice dread indeed, maybe I should relocate as well, some nice property for sale that you know of? 

Zohn,

American real estate in "on sale" right now. 

Come on over the price is right, buyer may even throw in a Larri

 ~ Ray ~
Logged

Mcknight Slope Dred ~ '59 bearclaw Sitka / Wavy African Mahogany
Eichelbaum OM ~ Euro Spruce / Brazilian Rosewood
Martin 000-18 Norman Blake
Larrivee Forum III ~ All Hog
Zohn
Gold Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2460




Ignore
« Reply #16 on: January 01, 2009, 07:02:05 AM »

Zohn,

American real estate in "on sale" right now. 

Come on over the price is right, buyer may even throw in a Larri

 ~ Ray ~
Nahhh, I'd rather be warm every day, and after all, my Larri's are good enough for me. Blessings for you and the crowd in 2009 buddie!!
Logged

"To me...music exists to elevate us as far as possible above everyday life." ~ Gabriel Faure
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to: