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Author Topic: All Praise K&K!  (Read 1392 times)
GA-ME
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« on: April 10, 2007, 02:12:03 PM »

I installed a K&K Pure Western Mini in a little 00 made from maple and spruce top as well as a Trinity Western Mini in my Larrivee 000-60. The installation was fairly straightforward and went well on both. I was pleasantly surprised to discover the 000 was already drilled for electronics so that took some of the sweat factor out! I used a Forstner 1/2 inch bit to drill the maple guitar and placed duct tape over the guitar's end block prior to drilling. It went smooth as silk. Now for the important part................... the maple guitar sounds superb with no preamp at all and when I add a little tube preamp to it it is so warm and natural that  I thought I'd wasted the extra money on the Trinity but that was not the case the blend from the BPT and the Mic is superb ..............I hooked up to my friends basement PA and the Larry was haunting on Hardtime Killing Floor and a few other tunes. I can not wait to play at a local open Mic on Thursday. People have been digging me just miking the natural guitar but I was loosing a lot of dynamics because they had to scale the gain way back to keep Mic from feeding back into the monitors. I can say that  I think the K&K is a very natural sounding pickup and I am all perches! I really think the Pure mini is a great deal and plan to install one in my dred next.
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Fstpicker
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« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2007, 03:58:30 AM »

Good report and glad you found the K&K PU's. Let us know how your gigs go with it.

Jeff
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« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2007, 07:06:15 PM »

Played out for about a forty minute set on Thursday and ran into a few glitches. The straight K&K Pure Western mini was awesome! Great clarity and really picked up the voice of my maple 00. The Trinity system though was another story. I have some work to do trying to figure out the correct blend and the correct way to run the signal to the house board. I was playing the Larrivee 000-60 with the Trinity in it and it was a night mare at full house volume. It went crazy microphonic on the Skip James stuff in open d minor. I was really disappointed because in my friend's basement on his PA we dialed in an absolutely stunning tone by blending the signal at the K and K preamp and sending a signle mono signal to the board. We had quite a bit of volume and were able to blend just enough microphone to get an amazingly accurate acoustic tone. At the gig though it went south, I think the monitors were to close and too centered in front. I think it may be better to send two separate mono signals to the board and let me blend at the preamp for just volume levels on the Mic and BPT while the soundman adjusts the  signals seperately so the sound man will have an easier time notching troublesome frequencies from the Mic. Early in the coming week I am going to go over the soundman's house and we are going to get the correct settings at his place so it will be easier next Thursday to dial in a good tone at the pub. My buddy is also going to go with the sound man to the pub and help him do what I think he referred to as "pinking" the room to find troublesome frequencies......all sounds too complicated for me. The lack of effects and equipment was what drew me to the acoustic in the first place! I will say that the tone we achieved at my friends is worth what ever headaches I run into in the learning curve though.
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dberch
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« Reply #3 on: April 15, 2007, 06:43:24 AM »

I don't know if this is possible, but is there any way to send the mic signal just to the house and not back throught the PA?  You could just send the mini through the PA...
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ronmac
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« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2007, 11:55:35 AM »

I don't know if this is possible, but is there any way to send the mic signal just to the house and not back throught the PA?  You could just send the mini through the PA...


That is the most common way to eliminate monitor feedback when using a microphone. The mixer should have an individual send control for each channel. Ask the sound tech to give you monitor on the channel with the SBT only.
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Ron

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« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2007, 02:13:09 PM »

dberch, it is possible to send the signal in a variety of ways with the Trinity System preamp. The unit has the two volume controls and two lines out. If you run the stereo cable in and then a mono cable out the main/mix outlet you are then blending the Mic and the pickup levels at the preamp. You also have the option of running two mono  cables out to separate channels at the board with the volume controls, controlling each signal independently but giving the sound guy the option to eq each signal independently at the board( I suspect that this will result in the most control over feedback) and finally you also have the option of sending a mono signal out the Mic out plug which paradoxically ends up sending only the pickup signal to the board. I think with some learning curve the Trinity System will result in a great sound for  small pubs, coffeehouse type things and such. What truly amazed me though was how incredible the straight Pure Western Mini sounds with my Maple 00. I run it into an ART tube preamp(like 40bucks) and into the board and it was incredible. PS. dberch, your post saying that the k and k was a great pickup if you want  it to sound like your guitar was one of the swaying factors in giving the pickups a chance and I am really happy with them thanks
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sdelsolray
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« Reply #6 on: April 15, 2007, 04:37:21 PM »

I first put a K&K pickup and internal mic into a gigging guitar about 7 years ago.  I still use a K&K pickup and internal mic in one of my guitars.  The only way I know to get those two source to work together optimally is to have separate eq for each source prior to any blending of the separate signals.
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dberch
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« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2007, 05:18:18 PM »

dberch, it is possible to send the signal in a variety of ways with the Trinity System preamp. The unit has the two volume controls and two lines out.
Cool.  I'd definitley try keeping the mic out of the monitor and see if that helps with feedback.  Also, watch monitor placement. Ever play pool?  Sound from the monitor will ricochet just like a pool ball. Off the wall behind you and back into the mic, even off your guitar into the mic if it's agled just right. I once had some nasty intermittend feedback and found out it was a big old 15" monitor bouncing sound off my guitar into the mic, but only when I was leaning a certain way!  Kicked the monitor to change the angle by a few degrees and the feedback went away.

PS. dberch, your post saying that the k and k was a great pickup if you want  it to sound like your guitar was one of the swaying factors in giving the pickups a chance and I am really happy with them thanks
Thank you kindly! You CAN improve the sound of a Mini with the mic, but for me, the extra money, eqpuipment, and hassle of blending/splitting/EQing two signals is just not worth it for the amout of improved tone.  Just my opinion!  Others may differ and I promise not to argue about it today. I love gear, but I'm not really a techie and I get confused easily with too many controls.
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dwdelcam
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« Reply #8 on: April 22, 2007, 10:09:29 AM »

Howdy !  I have a similar setup in my L-09.  I send the IBeam pickup straight out, but the microphone output goes  through a LRBaggs paracoustic DI so I can eq that signal  before it gets to the house mixer.  Ive cured MOST if not all of my feedback problems this way, and I've retained that sound you described.    Enjoy your K&K and don't give up ! Happy picking.
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David

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« Reply #9 on: April 22, 2007, 10:13:24 AM »

I wanted to add that sdelsoray was dead on in his assessment.  I just didnt have another eq box to do both signals so I do it on the mic end ! thanks!
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David

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Martin J-40                       Guild GAD M20
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flatlander
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« Reply #10 on: April 27, 2007, 04:15:50 PM »

 "I think the monitors were to close and too centered in front."
Quick and dirty on that when you don't have time or soundmans attention, is don't set up directly in front of monitors and angle them away from guitar a little. Doesn't take that much to help a lot. If theres a hard wall behind you, that angle also helps from bouncing straight back into vocal mic.
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