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Main Forums => Other Guitar Makers => Topic started by: RandyB on October 29, 2017, 09:36:47 PM



Title: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: RandyB on October 29, 2017, 09:36:47 PM
I have 2 nice wood guitars .. a Larrivee OM-40R and a. stonebrdge/Furch G23CR-C I love them both but
I am curious about the Emerald  X20 or the Carbon Acoustics GX or a Rainsong CH-WS1000NS
The problem is I can't find any of these in Oklahoma City.
Has anyone had the chance to play any of these? Thoughts?

 :donut :donut :coffee


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: George on October 29, 2017, 10:43:07 PM
I currently own a Composite Acoustics GX with a narrow nut width and wine red top. The fretboard is perfectly flat and saddle height adjustments have little impact on first fret string heights.  These guitars are absolutely impervious to temperature and humidity changes.  The tonal quality is also superb, considering it is not a wooden guitar...  I don't think much of the Fishman electronics in mine, but I have heard these guitars sound great with other units.  Upper fret access is very good because of the body shape.  Great tuning machines, neck is quite playable, frets are excellent.  The finish is so slick the guitar will slide off your lap if you don't hang on to it.  The only negative thing I have found, for me at least, is the strap button on the upper bout does not lend well to holding the guitar close to the body...


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: eded on October 29, 2017, 11:28:15 PM
I had a CA (I forget the model, and it was before their association with Peavey), and I had an Emerald X7 (maybe an X5?). Before long, I found they weren’t for me.  I played several Rainsongs that I thought were excellent, but I usually need some time to figure out if a guitar is for me.

Ed


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: ST on October 30, 2017, 12:29:20 AM
My Composite Acoustics Cargo (http://The Cargo With Electronics - Composite Acoustics)  serves me well. It ticks all the boxes.

✔ Playability - extremely comfortable (I like the 22.75" short scale)

✔ Comfort - fine to play standing or sitting or any other position I've tried

✔ Travel - I've had no trouble taking it as carry-on baggage on planes

✔ Nearly indestructible - I can leave it in the trunk of the car

✔ Sound - it sounds good to me and it sounds good to the people in front of me

I've never thought, "I wish this was made of wood".

I've received only compliments and positive comments about it.

If I lost it, I would replace it.

For anyone with my priorities, I recommend it.

ST


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: broKen on October 30, 2017, 01:59:02 AM
The OX has been on my radar for some time. Some day...


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: Barefoot Rob on October 30, 2017, 03:57:46 AM
Koamon just got himself a Peavey made CA short scale small body I don't know the modal but nice little guitar a great player now that I redid the nut slots.


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: AZLiberty on October 30, 2017, 06:22:02 AM
Um, maybe.  ;-)

(https://i.imgur.com/o93WfZO.jpg?2)

(https://i.imgur.com/xYIt0Ua.jpg?2)



Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: AZLiberty on October 30, 2017, 06:42:12 AM
I've never actually played a Composite Acoustics (pre or post Peavy buyout)

Rainsongs are pretty traditional.  Traditional body sizes 0, OM/000, D, J.  Their signature WS body isn't really that different than a Guild mini-jumbo or Taylor GA.  Necks are flat at 20", compared to Larrivee's compound 17-20" board.

The unidirectional carbon top on the CH series is supposed to sound more "woody" than normal CF, but if so it's subtle.  At the price point, either the new CH-OM or CH-WS are pretty hard to beat as a "do everything" guitar.  Note that all of the CH models are a 24.9" short scale, so the OM is really a 000 by any sane definition.

Since Rainsong builds on traditional body sizes it is easy to find a hard case that fits properly.  Rainsong uses very expensive machined aluminum molds, so what they offer is what you get.


Emerald uses a completely different building technique, and their bodies are much more modern/creative.  They have a molded in arm-bevel which makes them quite comfortable to hold.  The X-20 is a pretty big guitar (Taylor GA size) but it "feels" smaller because of the bevel.   Emerald uses a Martin standard 16" fretboard radius.  If you want a hard-case, then you need to order one with your guitar since the sizes are unique.

Emerald uses a less expensive (possibly disposable) molding technique, so just about any custom option you want is on the table. They even have an option for embedding custom wood veneers under the topcoat, which look frankly stunning. (also quite expensive)

The other big player is Blackbird which is currently transitioning from carbon fiber to a new synthetic material called eKoa.

Edit to add: in my experience CF guitars really reflect the strings used more than wooden instruments, so if you play one and find it sounds harsh or too bright it could well be the strings and not the guitar.



Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: Queequeg on October 30, 2017, 05:30:35 PM
My Composite Acoustics Cargo (http://The Cargo With Electronics - Composite Acoustics)  serves me well. It ticks all the boxes.

✔ Playability - extremely comfortable (I like the 22.75" short scale)

✔ Comfort - fine to play standing or sitting or any other position I've tried

✔ Travel - I've had no trouble taking it as carry-on baggage on planes

✔ Nearly indestructible - I can leave it in the trunk of the car

✔ Sound - it sounds good to me and it sounds good to the people in front of me

I've never thought, "I wish this was made of wood".

I've received only compliments and positive comments about it.

If I lost it, I would replace it.

For anyone with my priorities, I recommend it.

ST

I have a CA and agree with the above on all counts.
I bought it for the durability in Michigan's harsh winters and got so much more.


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: eded on October 30, 2017, 05:54:01 PM
I've never actually played a Composite Acoustics (pre or post Peavy buyout)

Rainsongs are pretty traditional.  Traditional body sizes 0, OM/000, D, J.  Their signature WS body isn't really that different than a Guild mini-jumbo or Taylor GA.  Necks are flat at 20", compared to Larrivee's compound 17-20" board.

The unidirectional carbon top on the CH series is supposed to sound more "woody" than normal CF, but if so it's subtle.  At the price point, either the new CH-OM or CH-WS are pretty hard to beat as a "do everything" guitar.  Note that all of the CH models are a 24.9" short scale, so the OM is really a 000 by any sane definition.

Since Rainsong builds on traditional body sizes it is easy to find a hard case that fits properly.  Rainsong uses very expensive machined aluminum molds, so what they offer is what you get.


Emerald uses a completely different building technique, and their bodies are much more modern/creative.  They have a molded in arm-bevel which makes them quite comfortable to hold.  The X-20 is a pretty big guitar (Taylor GA size) but it "feels" smaller because of the bevel.   Emerald uses a Martin standard 16" fretboard radius.  If you want a hard-case, then you need to order one with your guitar since the sizes are unique.

Emerald uses a less expensive (possibly disposable) molding technique, so just about any custom option you want is on the table. They even have an option for embedding custom wood veneers under the topcoat, which look frankly stunning. (also quite expensive)

The other big player is Blackbird which is currently transitioning from carbon fiber to a new synthetic material called eKoa.

Edit to add: in my experience CF guitars really reflect the strings used more than wooden instruments, so if you play one and find it sounds harsh or too bright it could well be the strings and not the guitar.



Nice writeup... 

I have a boat (a pontoon boat) that I take out on a "lake" (actually, the Susquehanna River between two dams).  I would love to have a plastic (CF) guitar to take out on it.  I have taken the parlor, but since it is used (basically) as a party barge with lots of swimming, I hesitate.

Ed


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: AZLiberty on October 31, 2017, 02:07:35 AM
Nice writeup... 

I have a boat (a pontoon boat) that I take out on a "lake" (actually, the Susquehanna River between two dams).  I would love to have a plastic (CF) guitar to take out on it.  I have taken the parlor, but since it is used (basically) as a party barge with lots of swimming, I hesitate.

Ed

The Emerald X-7 in my pic above (next to my Parlor) would be perfect for that.  A hair smaller than the parlor.  Also one of the most affordable options at just under one grand.

http://emeraldguitars.com/product/x7-opus/?v=7516fd43adaa

Emerald's prices include shipping, and there are no import duties (in the US) on guitars from Ireland.


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: Mikeymac on October 31, 2017, 04:43:31 PM
The Emerald X-7 in my pic above (next to my Parlor) would be perfect for that.  A hair smaller than the parlor.  Also one of the most affordable options at just under one grand.

http://emeraldguitars.com/product/x7-opus/?v=7516fd43adaa

Emerald's prices include shipping, and there are no import duties (in the US) on guitars from Ireland.

I just ran across the Emerald brand, and am very interested in the X-20 (they make lefties!!!). I think the Amber color is stunning! Thanks for posting about these - you have increased my GAS significantly...

 :rolleye:   :donut :coffee


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: rockstar_not on November 01, 2017, 12:35:33 AM
McPherson is also making carbon fiber guitars. A friend of mine is one of their demonstration staff


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: AZLiberty on November 01, 2017, 06:25:55 AM
I just ran across the Emerald brand, and am very interested in the X-20 (they make lefties!!!). I think the Amber color is stunning! Thanks for posting about these - you have increased my GAS significantly...

 :rolleye:   :donut :coffee

Yeah, I keep thinking about an X-20-12 in Amber.  But, for only a couple hundred more I could get a double neck 6/12.

Emeralds colors are interesting, depending on the lighting they can be very subtle, or really pop.  Here is a pic of me holding my brother in law's X20.  It's bright red in the sun, but in the shade you can barely tell it's red.

(https://i.imgur.com/rpaqa7F.jpg?2)





Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: Mikeymac on November 02, 2017, 06:59:40 PM

Yeah, I keep thinking about an X-20-12 in Amber.  But, for only a couple hundred more I could get a double neck 6/12.

Emeralds colors are interesting, depending on the lighting they can be very subtle, or really pop.  Here is a pic of me holding my brother in law's X20.  It's bright red in the sun, but in the shade you can barely tell it's red.


Since you have experience with these, what is the scale length of the X-7? Of the X-20? It doesn't say anywhere on their website (just says the guitars have a 1 3/4" nut, which is perfect). Would you say the X-20 is about the size of an OM? (I'm not familiar with Taylor's body sizes...)



Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: AZLiberty on November 03, 2017, 02:58:43 AM
The X-20 normally comes with a standard 25.4" scale length. (Same as a standard scale Larrivee)

My X-7 is 20" maybe 20-1/8".  Same as a Larrivee Parlor to within an 1/8 of an inch.  I got out a tape measure and measured both.

I've only played the X-20 once.  My BIL lives in Indiana and I'm in Phoenix.  My impression was that the X-20 is a pretty big guitar. Closer to a Taylor GA (x14) than an OM.   Taylor's GA is a copy of a Guild mini-jumbo, so if you are familiar with a Guild F-212.  So, bigger than an OM, slightly smaller than an L body.  The arm rest makes it "feel" smaller than that, but still bigger than an OM.

The folks at Emerald no longer list the X-10 as regular production, but rumor has it they will build one if asked.


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: Mikeymac on November 03, 2017, 01:46:14 PM
Thanks for the info...

...I contacted Emerald and they got back to me - confirmed that the X-20 is indeed 25.5" scale length, which is perfect.

You're right, the body looks about OM size to me, but maybe they're a little larger - which is fine by me.

They also confirmed for me that they make a number of X-20 Opus and Artisans in lefty; here's their reply:

The X20 is available in Lefty in all its variations, meaning you can get it as a 7-string, 12-string, Nylon String, Baritone or even 8, 9 or 10-string. Of course you have all the custom shop options available to you too. None of our other instruments are currently available as Lefty in our standard range. In theory, it is of course possible to get one of the other instruments made in Lefty, but as this would involve making a brand new mould for it, the cost would be very high, and therefore no one has done this, yet.

I've got one of these "built" and sitting in the shopping cart online...just have to arrange my finances to pull the trigger...

BTW, the Parlor has a 24" scale length, no? What about the X-7?


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: eded on November 03, 2017, 01:54:58 PM

BTW, the Parlor has a 24" scale length, no? What about the X-7?

Fwiw, on the page for each model, there are tabs for description, more info, review, and videos. Under the more info tab, there are all the specs...  scale length, bout widths, body depth, etc.

And, the X-7 is 24”.

Ed


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: AZLiberty on November 03, 2017, 08:14:12 PM

BTW, the Parlor has a 24" scale length, no? What about the X-7?

I got out my tape measure and measured both the Parlor and the X-7.  Both are 24".

I figure physical measurements beat the manufacturer's quoted measurements any day.  We know they can often be a bit off.


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: Mikeymac on November 05, 2017, 05:27:39 AM
Just for kicks, this is what I have built and sitting in the shopping cart (hey, it only takes money, right?):



Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: George on November 05, 2017, 01:23:27 PM
Just for kicks, this is what I have built and sitting in the shopping cart (hey, it only takes money, right?):



Looks very nice Rev.  Do they have a narrow nut option in their build app?


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: Mikeymac on November 05, 2017, 09:08:06 PM
Looks very nice Rev.  Do they have a narrow nut option in their build app?

Yes, they have a very extensive custom shop... But I'm not sure how pricey some of those options would be. You can contact them from their website and find out. They respond pretty quickly during the work week (remember the time difference if you're in the US/Canada).


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: JSpe on November 06, 2017, 05:35:39 AM
I have a Rainsong shorty that I really like. It has a flat finish, so there was a bit of a scratchy sound when it was strummed  hard, so I put a small, shaped, clear pickguard on and it solved the problem. I love the short scale and om size, and the sound is very sweet, particularly with elixir 80-20 lights. Its great for those frozen days in winter, and the boiling hot humid summer days, and also the now and thens. It has a great case but also fits perfectly in a classical guitar gig bag, so it fits the grab and go very perfectly. Great electronics too (Fishman). Real nice customer service over in Woodinvale, Washington as well!


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: RandyB on November 10, 2017, 04:05:26 PM
Um, maybe.  ;-)





How does the Rainsong compare to the Larrivee OM? Could you post a finger picking comparison video or soundcloud audio clip?


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: AZLiberty on November 12, 2017, 03:43:21 AM


How does the Rainsong compare to the Larrivee OM? Could you post a finger picking comparison video or soundcloud audio clip?

I can try to do that when I am back in town.  Can fingerpick the Rainsong, my OM-03R, and my wife;s OM-03


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: Mikeymac on November 15, 2017, 05:50:52 PM


How does the Rainsong compare to the Larrivee OM? Could you post a finger picking comparison video or soundcloud audio clip?

So, Randy, are you still looking at these (the Emeralds)?  I'm getting close to pulling the trigger on one (on ordering one, I should say - may take them several months to get it built).

I can try to do that when I am back in town.  Can fingerpick the Rainsong, my OM-03R, and my wife;s OM-03

Waiting, waiting...

 :humour:

 :donut :coffee


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: Swampdigger on November 16, 2017, 03:07:48 AM
I have a Rainsong shorty full gloss. That was my first carbon guitar. Its a beautiful guitar. Its the guitar that travels with me. I have a larrivee
om -04 Bloodwood and an omv-60. I like them all. My most recent addition an Emerald x-20 Woody with a Korelian Burl top in green. The veneer top is not considered to affect the guitar tone but it sure does make the guitar an individual. I think that has been where carbon guitars have been missing out. As far as the x20 it sounds as nice as it looks but its not wood. There are a lot of good choices out there now in carbon guitars. My choices have been good for me and I will keep both.               


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: AZLiberty on November 16, 2017, 03:22:54 AM
Waiting, waiting...


No proper mic, so this will probably sound pretty compressed:

https://soundcloud.com/rocket_song/3-guitars-sound-samples

Two Larrivee OM's and a Rainsong.   All have PB strings, but different brands and ages.


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: Barefoot Rob on November 16, 2017, 03:43:09 AM
Mike get a bone saddle the graphit one s**k's


Title: Re: Anyone here play a carbon fiber guitar?
Post by: L07 Shooting Star on November 16, 2017, 07:34:18 AM
No proper mic, so this will probably sound pretty compressed:

https://soundcloud.com/rocket_song/3-guitars-sound-samples

Two Larrivee OM's and a Rainsong.   All have PB strings, but different brands and ages.

Nice little demo.  They all sound nice, just slightly different.  I didn't detect any significant difference in the sound or vibe of the Rainsong compared to the other two all-wood guitars.  If I had to pick my favorite tone of the 3, I would chose the OM-03.