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Main Forums => Technical Discussion => Topic started by: jojo on April 08, 2009, 02:20:43 AM



Title: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: jojo on April 08, 2009, 02:20:43 AM
I'm sure  you've seen guitar ads on ebay and such with this line:  "...from a smoke-free home." Besides the potential of a guitar from a smoking household having a smoky smell, does cigarette smoke do any sort of damage to a guitar? Is the tone somehow compromised?

I find it hard to believe that second hand smoke is going to somehow harm a guitar. But if you have the science to show otherwise, please do.

Incidentally, I recently got an old Airline acoustic guitar with a hazy layer of grunge on it. I used Murphy's oil soap to clean it off. Left chocolate brown marks all over the rag. Later, the seller mentioned that the previous owner was a heavy smoker. Other than the grunge, the Airline seemed pretty healthy.

Although it was unable to ascend even one flight of steps.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: flatlander on April 08, 2009, 02:52:43 AM
As long as it wasn't the house itself on fire, no. I'm wouldn't turn down a player cause it has a little bar smell on it.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: tadol on April 08, 2009, 03:15:58 AM
Some people really freak out about the smell of nicotine, and rather than risk a buyer getting all upset about the potential of a little cigarette smell, it is always a good idea to disclose it. But whether or not a guitar was expsoed to smoke would not be a deal breaker to me -

Tad


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: RoundLakeDT on April 08, 2009, 03:25:10 AM
After a few decades of smoke inhalation, guitars tend to acquire a deep, sexy/raspy voice that sounds great playing just about anything, even just playing names from the phone book

(Of course the frequent hacking coughs tend to dismay the audience a little, but such is the price of art)   :tongue:


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: Danny on April 08, 2009, 05:11:32 AM
 It is a bit of a downer when you find a nice deal on a git and it smells like something crawled in the soundhole and passed GAS.
 I like the smell of wood and especially these new gits (vanilla). If the case is what smells you can always replace it or use a lot of Febreeze and then put it out in the sunshine for a few days.
 It will actually knock the smokey smell out. Wood is another story.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: tuffythepug on April 08, 2009, 05:24:09 AM
Having been a heavey smoker for about 25 years I had no idea how bad cigarette smoke smelled until I had quit for awhile.  Then, after quitting, I realized how bad a smoker's car could smell, or how the smell permeated drapes and other surfaces in a house.   I don't think I could stand to play a guitar that smelled a lot like stale cigarettes so the information that a guitar came from a smoke free home would be a plus for me.   I'm not preaching against smoking or smokers;   I've been there and didn't even give a thought to the smell because I was de-sensitized to it;  but when you quit and regain a keen sense of smell it's kinda disgusting.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: Zohn on April 08, 2009, 06:10:29 AM
Having been a heavey smoker for about 25 years I had no idea how bad cigarette smoke smelled until I had quit for awhile.  Then, after quitting, I realized how bad a smoker's car could smell, or how the smell permeated drapes and other surfaces in a house.   I don't think I could stand to play a guitar that smelled a lot like stale cigarettes so the information that a guitar came from a smoke free home would be a plus for me.   I'm not preaching against smoking or smokers;   I've been there and didn't even give a thought to the smell because I was de-sensitized to it;  but when you quit and regain a keen sense of smell it's kinda disgusting.
Hey Tuffy!
 :+1: I used to smoke as well, and agree with your post in every way. I do believe however, that a "smoke-free" guitar is just another sales-gimmick aimed at potential buyers like you and myself. It is a known fact that everything, including the guitar is permeated with the smell, but it wears off after a wile. My Walden smelled of smoke for weeks from a weekend-away and spending time around camp-fires. I guess if it's kept inside the case like mine, it takes longer.
Interesting - cigarette-burn-marks at the headstock of vintage guitars, are regarded as an authentic vintage feature - just another intriguing facet to the mystery surrounding vintage guitars and their value. - imagine what Keith Richards' guitars smell like.... :yak:


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: Trinity Guitars on April 08, 2009, 11:10:21 AM
Smoky guitars do bother me. I never smoked but grew up in a smoking home and have always hated the smell of stale smoke. I would not be able enjoy a guitar with this smell. I do have customers ask if used guitars smell like smoke. Like me there are many that will not buy one with the smell.
  If I get one in the studio I have to keep it in the case. It can stink up the room and kill the great wood smell of 100 new guitars!
Jim Holler


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: bearsville0 on April 08, 2009, 11:19:54 AM


I wouldn't turn down a player cause it has a little bar smell on it.

I wouldn't be bothered by the smokey smell so much, but the stale whiskey on the breath would be a real turnoff.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: BenF on April 08, 2009, 11:33:16 AM
I gave up smoking 3 years ago, and cannot stand the smell of stale smoke now.  I totally understand why people say that on adds for clothes and toys etc, but perhaps on a guitar it is a bit OTT.  However, comments above suggest that you can smell it.  I suspect the smell would last quite a long time on an acoustic guitar too.

Put it this way, it wouldn't stop me buying a nice guitar, but I would prefer if it didn't smell rank. 

And Tuffy, the car thing is so true.  So many carpets and seat covers in such a confined space to absorb odours.  You don't notice it until you quit.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: bluesman67 on April 08, 2009, 11:51:40 AM
I don't consider it a sales gimmick at all.  It's useful info that means a lot to a significant % of the population!  That's all it is.  Smokers could care less about this fact, but any non smoker would be happy to know it.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: hadden on April 08, 2009, 12:17:21 PM
I'm one who doesn't want a guitar I buy stinking of cigarettes.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: strawintogold on April 08, 2009, 12:20:15 PM
Having been a heavey smoker for about 25 years I had no idea how bad cigarette smoke smelled until I had quit for awhile.  Then, after quitting, I realized how bad a smoker's car could smell, or how the smell permeated drapes and other surfaces in a house.   I don't think I could stand to play a guitar that smelled a lot like stale cigarettes so the information that a guitar came from a smoke free home would be a plus for me.   I'm not preaching against smoking or smokers;   I've been there and didn't even give a thought to the smell because I was de-sensitized to it;  but when you quit and regain a keen sense of smell it's kinda disgusting.

Yep, what he said.

holly


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: ducktrapper on April 08, 2009, 12:31:27 PM
I prefer living in a smoke free home but wouldn't let the absence of one stop me from buying an instrument.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: bearsville0 on April 08, 2009, 12:32:21 PM
I wonder how many people quit smoking not for health reasons but out of embarrassment for going around stinking like that.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: tuffythepug on April 08, 2009, 02:45:08 PM
I wonder how many people quit smoking not for health reasons but out of embarrassment for going around stinking like that.


My guess is that it would be a very tiny percentage.   When you smoke you don't know you stink.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: bluesman67 on April 08, 2009, 02:46:52 PM
dulls the senses, you don't know you stink...but you do!!


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: BenF on April 08, 2009, 02:49:18 PM
Same applies to my guitar playing.  My senses are dulled by listening to myself all the time, so I don't notice, but i stink!!


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: bearsville0 on April 08, 2009, 04:00:50 PM
Same applies to my guitar playing.  My senses are dulled by listening to myself all the time, so I don't notice, but i stink!!

You know, I was watching a bunch of YouTube home videos last night of people playing the same simple classical pieces that I've been working on. Boy, it was gruesome to see the how apparently unaware they were of the atrocious sounds they were making. And then it hit, I probably sound that bad too! I promise to only practice in the woodshed from now on.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: BenF on April 08, 2009, 04:02:25 PM
You know, I was watching a bunch of YouTube home videos last night of people playing the same simple classical pieces that I've been working on. Boy, it was gruesome to see the how apparently unaware they were of the atrocious sounds they were making. And then it hit, I probably sound that bad too! I promise to only practice in the woodshed from now on.

I have been working on a song for a few days, thought I was doing well, and recorded a simple video of it with my camcorder.  It was like listening to cats fighting.  I blame it on the camcorder. :humour:


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: bearsville0 on April 08, 2009, 04:05:53 PM
I have been working on a song for a few days, thought I was doing well, and recorded a simple video of it with my camcorder.  It was like listening to cats fighting.  I blame it on the camcorder. :humour:

When I get around to recording myself, I'll make sure I keep a bucket of fresh water next to me to give the camera a good dunking if it starts to misrepresent me.

And then I'll take up smoking.....


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: ffinke on April 08, 2009, 04:22:38 PM
Time for a word from our thread...

"Smoke free home" in the sales pitch means the person is a snob and proud of it or wants to be politcally correct. It's getting to the point that it really doesn't mean anything anymore (it's overdone) but then again there are hyper-sensitive people that can't handle even the word cigarette.

I used to smoke (I should have saved the green stamps for the quadruple by-pass) but don't anymore. Even in a restaurant I request "first available" because I really don't mind. Same way with guitars. I only hope the really good ones come from a smoke filled home and the seller discounts it to my budget.

BTW... Thanks for asking.

fred


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: strawintogold on April 08, 2009, 04:33:36 PM
Yeah, that must be it. Just a bunch of PC, hyper sensitive snobs. I'm feeling ever so elite. Let me go tell my asthmatic son that his smoke allergy is just him being high falutin'.

I think it's swell that the smell doesn't bother you. But I hardly think not wanting something that stinks puts anyone in the 'Let them eat cake' category.

holly


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: ducktrapper on April 08, 2009, 04:44:48 PM
ffinke - yes thanks for your opinion, now stfu. ;) 


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: tuffythepug on April 08, 2009, 05:14:31 PM
Time for a word from our thread...

"Smoke free home" in the sales pitch means the person is a snob and proud of it or wants to be politcally correct. It's getting to the point that it really doesn't mean anything anymore (it's overdone) but then again there are hyper-sensitive people that can't handle even the word cigarette.

 
fred

With all due respect aren't you overlooking a third possiblity ?:  i.e. the seller wants to sell their guitar and they want to keep the field of prospective buyers as wide as possible.  Why must it be either snobbery or pride and not simply full disclosure ?   Also, in my experience it's just about equal in terms of numbers regarding those who are hyper-sensitive anti-cigarette folks and those who smoke and are rude and belligerant with their smoking habit.   Folks at either extreme are not fun to be around.
I'm glad that cigarette smoke in a restaurant doesn't bother you.    Lucky you.  You can take the first available table.  But those who wait for a table in an area free of smoke are not necessarily snobs because of their preferance to enjoy their meal free from the stench of stale smoke.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: bluesman67 on April 08, 2009, 05:23:31 PM
I've been called a few things in before, but being called a snob is a new one to me.  Thanks ffinke, you know me so well.  :?


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: strawintogold on April 08, 2009, 05:28:50 PM
Wait a minute...if we are snobs (and proud of it which is kind of redundant) I'm not sure what that does to the level of snobbery already in place. Like, If I'm a snob, then where does that leave, say, Prince Charles? Would I be a sort of low class snob? Does it mean I get to start hanging out with Charles? I'm not ready for this level of social engagement.

holly


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: bluesman67 on April 08, 2009, 05:39:18 PM
Wait a minute...if we are snobs (and proud of it which is kind of redundant) I'm not sure what that does to the level of snobbery already in place. Like, If I'm a snob, then where does that leave, say, Prince Charles? Would I be a sort of low class snob? Does it mean I get to start hanging out with Charles? I'm not ready for this level of social engagement.

holly

What, I thought your FIII was ordered filled with a thousand $100 bills?  SNOB  :roll


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: strawintogold on April 08, 2009, 05:58:16 PM
As long as they aren't SMOKING....

holly


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: GA-ME on April 08, 2009, 05:59:55 PM
Y'all are funny!


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: strawintogold on April 08, 2009, 06:01:52 PM
No, darling, as of now we are strictly 'amusing'. Funny is so very low brow.

holly


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: lw216316 on April 08, 2009, 06:48:19 PM
Did anyone address your question ?

Quote
  Besides the potential of a guitar from a smoking household having a smoky smell, does cigarette smoke do any sort of damage to a guitar? Is the tone somehow compromised?
 

my answer is NO - the tone is not compromised by the smell. If it does not bother you then don't worry about it.

=====================================

Now, am I glad the ads answer the question about smoke ?  YES !
I have never smoked cigarettes
oh, ..ok....I  'experimented'  with cigarettes  (and one cigar )
but I did not inhale !!!

...ok,  ok,....I tried to inhale, but that didn't work out too well  :angry:
...I don't even want to  describe the cigar experience.

After my 'experimenting' I never got involved with tobacco.

All my adult life I have been VERY sensitive to tobacco smoke / smell -
It makes my eyes water,  my nose run,  my head ache ,
and constricts my throat and makes me cough and lose my voice, and makes me feel dissy.
...and it only takes the scent on someones clothes, etc to do it - there does not have to be a tobacco fire underway.
(except for that I have no problems at all with it   :mad:  )     


When I was young and first got involved with trying to learn to play guitar -
I was at a music shop and tried out a used Guild - it sounded good and I was hoping it could teach me to play like John Denver and his Guild so I bought it.

AFter I got home and opened the case, the tobacco smoke smell from inside the case almost made me sick.

I had not noticed the smell on the guitar at the shop - only after I got home....
and I had not even asked to look at the case.
I owned that guitar for about a year or so and never did get the smell out.

Learned a lesson from that  :thumb   - guitars can't teach me to play like John Denver.

- Larry



Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: Mr_LV19E on April 08, 2009, 08:04:12 PM
I don't want no stinky cigarette smoked up guitar in my house. I smoked for way too long and quit about 6 yrs ago. I'm truly sorry to all the people I inflicted with my stinky self.  I can't stand to go where there are smokers (though I do on occasion because I want to be social). The smell just turns my stomach and gives me a headache.  Plus when you have heart disease it's not good to be around smoke.
Now, if the guitar was previously owned by a pot smoker thats a different story. Oh the sweet smell of ganga.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: ryler on April 08, 2009, 08:48:26 PM
It would matter tremendously to me if the guitar smelled awful every time I played it.  I wouldn't buy one all smoked up.  So I think a seller including that detail in the ad is helpful.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: tadol on April 08, 2009, 09:14:24 PM
I don't want no stinky cigarette smoked up guitar in my house. I smoked for way too long and quit about 6 yrs ago. I'm truly sorry to all the people I inflicted with my stinky self.  I can't stand to go where there are smokers (though I do on occasion because I want to be social). The smell just turns my stomach and gives me a headache.  Plus when you have heart disease it's not good to be around smoke.
Now, if the guitar was previously owned by a pot smoker thats a different story. Oh the sweet smell of ganga.

Was waiting for that one - To be truly politically correct, you should also note whether the smoker preferred menthol or regulars, or the type of cigars. Anything else smoked should be clearly noted as to whether it was for medicinal or recreational reasons. In fact, you should also note whether you heat your home with wood or coal fires, or if you burn incense in the practice of your religion -

I understand the unpleasantness of smoking - I smoked for over 20 years, and finally gave up the cigarettes just over 15 years ago. Still don't enjoy the smell of them, but I also dislike an awful lot of colognes and prefumes people use as well, and don't get me started on all those smelly things people plug into their electrical outlets to mask yet other smells. But if you are truly allergic or overly sensitive to any chemical, I hope you make sure to ask about it early on before purchasing anything used, and not expecting everyone else to disclose every life detail in a for sale ad. Its nice if they add it - but shouldn't be expected.

Tad


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: bearsville0 on April 09, 2009, 12:11:24 AM
Anybody here in the habit of farting in their car?


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: flatlander on April 09, 2009, 01:35:18 AM
Who was it , Jeremy? That said Bob Taylor could fart into his guitars and they'd  sell like hot cakes as a special edition.
 Bearsville started it.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: bearsville0 on April 09, 2009, 02:25:44 AM

Bob Taylor could fart into his guitars and they'd  sell like hot cakes as a special edition.




(http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/rr199/greenlittlefishes/JimiFire.jpg)


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: jeremy3220 on April 09, 2009, 02:39:17 AM
Who was it , Jeremy? That said Bob Taylor could fart into his guitars and they'd  sell like hot cakes as a special edition.
 

the creature



Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: Danny on April 09, 2009, 04:17:48 AM
 Now boys, let's all play nice.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: flatlander on April 09, 2009, 04:31:54 AM
the creature


Sorry, that's right. It was pretty funny though.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: Zohn on April 09, 2009, 06:39:13 AM
where does that leave, say, Prince Charles?
holly
"Oh I say old chap" - I wonder which would be worse: in a smokey restaurant or with him , I'll have to eat "hot potatoes" all the time to maintain the accent.  :roll


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: Zohn on April 09, 2009, 06:47:16 AM
Lucky you.  You can take the first available table.  But those who wait for a table in an area free of smoke are not necessarily snobs because of their preferance to enjoy their meal free from the stench of stale smoke.
Besides the stench, when I eat, I need to rise for air every now and then too.
I must add that besides a long list of negative things in my country, I fully support the legislation prohibiting smoking in public and the work place.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: BenF on April 09, 2009, 07:36:36 AM
Besides the stench, when I eat, I need to rise for air every now and then too.
I must add that besides a long list of negative things in my country, I fully support the legislation prohibiting smoking in public and the work place.

Smoking in enclosed public spaces has been illegal for some time in Scotland now.  Despite initial objection from smokers, I believe the vast majority feel it has been a good thing.  You can take your kids anywhere now, and go out for a meal or to a pub without coming home stinking of smoke.  I disagree that the blanket ban should have been dictated in the way it was, and that there should have been some discretion involved from owners of pubs and restaurants, but a few years into the ban, it is just accepted as the norm now.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: Zohn on April 09, 2009, 07:38:44 AM
Smoking in enclosed public spaces has been illegal for some time in Scotland now.  Despite initial objection from smokers, I believe the vast majority feel it has been a good thing.  You can take your kids anywhere now, and go out for a meal or to a pub without coming home stinking of smoke.  I disagree that the blanket ban should have been dictated in the way it was, and that there should have been some discretion involved from owners of pubs and restaurants, but a few years into the ban, it is just accepted as the norm now.
:+1:


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: Queequeg on April 09, 2009, 12:39:08 PM
I'm guessing that the muppet fur in the cases is what really holds the smoke scent. If I got a guitar that had a strong smoke odor, I think I would begin by replacing the case.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: hatofthecat on April 09, 2009, 04:57:58 PM
Somebody shoot me down if I'm wrong but I pretty much remember that its the tar that smells and not the nicotine (and those yellow fingers are tar stains not nicotine).  Anyway I'd certainly consider it a plus that someone stated "smoke free home" as it perhaps suggets a little care in state of the guitar while they had it (though I did see one recently that was scratched to heck under the strings from wild use of a pick and owner kindly stated that it was smoke free.... "well thats ok then, you've used it to bang nails in but at least you didn't smoke any place near it....").  :blush:

I bought an old 1960's 12 string off ebay the other year and it STANK !!!! I had to refrain from leaning over close into the sound hole while playing as the smoke stink was pretty grim. The case was the worst though and it spent over month outside and then in my shed for two more.  I brought it in one evening thinking it smelt ok by then but by morning it had left my living room smelling like an 80 a day sumo wrestler's jock strap  :rolleye:

Quote
don't get me started on all those smelly things people plug into their electrical outlets to mask yet other smells
:yak: too right.... I helped some friends move into their new place last year and we unplugged over a dozen of those Glade chemical plant outlets.... apparently they were there to cover up the smell of a dog that previous owners had.... perhaps it was actually dead and they had buried it under the floorboards or something ?!?!?? ...  :wacko:

Quote
Smoking in enclosed public spaces has been illegal for some time in Scotland now
...and same in England too, is nice to be able to go out for a few beers and know whatever you are wearing won't have to go straight in the wash from cigarette stink when you get home  :rolleye:

Pete


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: Mr_LV19E on April 11, 2009, 04:54:10 PM
is nice to be able to go out for a few beers and know whatever you are wearing won't have to go straight in the wash from cigarette stink when you get home  :rolleye:

Pete

I would just like to be able to take a shower, go out to the pub for the evening and come home and go to bed without taking another shower.


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: ducktrapper on April 11, 2009, 05:23:09 PM
I'm guessing that the muppet fur in the cases ...


Oh the horror!  :ohmy:


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: strawintogold on April 11, 2009, 06:25:54 PM
Yes, It's just a matter of time before PETA get's involved....

holly


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: naboz on April 14, 2009, 01:05:32 PM
That's actually the reverse side of a nauga-hyde (hide); what the fur of a nauga actually looks like.   :rolleye:
They are protected now (Elmo was lead attorney in the case!), these are simulated--no naugas were harmed in the production of Larrivee cases  :bgrin:


Title: Re: Does "smoke free home" mean anything to you?
Post by: Queequeg on April 15, 2009, 12:33:52 PM
hey you can scoff, but if you think Oscar is grouchy now, just wait until his hair takes on the miasma of a dirty ashtray and turns into a yellow fetid furball.  :yak: