Forum IV guitar alive and well in AZ

[prof_stack]

Here's one from today, the Forum IV:


The OM-03MT sounds sweeter here in dry AZ than it did in Seattle. 

Humidity might have something to do with it, or perhaps it is the daily playing since it sits out always ready for action.

[JOYCEfromNS]

Beautiful!

[jpmist]

Nice!

I ran across an old pic of mine with a pang of regret. No one makes mahogany look as lovely as Larrivee. There was a lot I liked about that guitar and thankful to this forum for getting one as well as setting me on the path to the two lovely OO's I have now.

OMG, it's been 10 years hasn't it!

[prof_stack]

Nice!

I ran across an old pic of mine with a pang of regret. No one makes mahogany look as lovely as Larrivee. There was a lot I liked about that guitar and thankful to this forum for getting one as well as setting me on the path to the two lovely OO's I have now.

OMG, it's been 10 years hasn't it!

Thanks.  Yes, it's been about 10 years.  How is that possible?   

[guitarman001]

Nice!

I ran across an old pic of mine with a pang of regret. No one makes mahogany look as lovely as Larrivee. There was a lot I liked about that guitar and thankful to this forum for getting one as well as setting me on the path to the two lovely OO's I have now.

OMG, it's been 10 years hasn't it!

I noticed you have both an OO-05 and OO-03 short scale... is the short scale 24.75" and how does that compare to the full-scale OO?

[Queequeg]

I remember that pic.
Lovely.

[jpmist]

I noticed you have both an OO-05 and OO-03 short scale... is the short scale 24.75" and how does that compare to the full-scale OO?

Hey g-man, I wish I could give you a credible answer. My ears are shot so I don't have a lot of confidence in reporting. That said what I can say is the O3 is a short scale with a cutaway, the O5 is a std scale with Italian spruce. There's enough difference there to make a comparison awkward because the Italian spruce is stiffer than the spruce on the 03 (can't recall name at the moment, but boy is it dark now!). Then there's the cutaway on the 03 which some folks say affects the tone since there's 5% or so less top, but then that spot doesn't offer much vibration. About the only generalization I can make is that the 05 is brighter, the 03 "softer" in tone which is about what you might expect with a brighter top with a long scale versus a softer spruce top with a short scale neck. I doubt the cutaway affects much.

If you'd like to hear some tracks, I have some comparison tracks on Soundcloud. This one is the 03 versus a rosewood spruce OO normal scale - https://soundcloud.com/jpmist/compare-03-44?si=4a55cff90e604cf9bab0fb9cc4c284dc&utm_source=clipboard&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=social_sharing

The 05 is on another comparison track here with a Gretch OO and a Taylor 322 hog/blackwood, all 12 frets of course! - https://soundcloud.com/jpmist/test-track-05-g-322?si=1b13875f5442427287e1dff6383a8300&utm_source=clipboard&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=social_sharing

The flaw will be these were recorded with two different setups so you've given me something to do this week. I'll put together a brief comparison instrumental with the 05 and 03 so you can hear for yourself!

[jpmist]

I remember that pic.
Lovely.

Thanks! Didn't catch this zombie post so that was a pleasant surprise. I'll always be thankful this one got me on 12-frets forever, since 14 frets simply don't please my ear in comparison. It took about 3 or 4 guitars to finally give up on hog-tops. Dunno what it is, perhaps I miss the resonance a spruce top gives or perhaps my ear was set to that tone after 10 years with a Taylor spruce/mahogany.

The palm in the background is still alive which I consider an accomplishment <grin>

[guitarman001]

Thanks for this and the upcoming other clips - I'm just on holiday in Germany but will 100% catch this properly on my home speakers upon my return next week...

Sound aside, do you find the cutaway helps with access? I've never found them to overmuch

[teh]

Regarding cutaways, I have an all mahogany 14 fret, 12 string with Venetian cutaway (LV03) and a 25.5 scale, 12 fret, Forum VI (LSV03) that both provide easy access to the upper frets. Aesthetically, I think the L body is ideally suited for a Venetian cutaway compared to other body sizes (Dread, 00, 000, OM).

The rest of my guitars are non-cutaway including two 24.9 scale, 12 fret guitars - a Larrivée maple parlor and a Martin 000 spruce and mahogany. I can get to the 14th or 15th fret easily.

Worth noting; all three of my Larrivees have a Satin finish, bone nut and saddle and I don't think anyone does a satin finish better than Larrivée. My parlor and LV03 are both over 17 years old and show minimal wear.

[jpmist]

Sound aside, do you find the cutaway helps with access?

Nah, I almost never fret a note that would need that cutaway space. The highest I'll generally play a capo is on the 5th fret and my playing will span the 5 frets above that so the cutaway never comes in play. Generally I'll reserve playing the lead break to "Hotel California" on my strat instead of an acoustic  

I simply prefer the look of a cutaway so all things being equal that'll be the one I pick.

[guitarman001]

Hey g-man, I wish I could give you a credible answer. My ears are shot so I don't have a lot of confidence in reporting. That said what I can say is the O3 is a short scale with a cutaway, the O5 is a std scale with Italian spruce. There's enough difference there to make a comparison awkward because the Italian spruce is stiffer than the spruce on the 03 (can't recall name at the moment, but boy is it dark now!). Then there's the cutaway on the 03 which some folks say affects the tone since there's 5% or so less top, but then that spot doesn't offer much vibration. About the only generalization I can make is that the 05 is brighter, the 03 "softer" in tone which is about what you might expect with a brighter top with a long scale versus a softer spruce top with a short scale neck. I doubt the cutaway affects much.

If you'd like to hear some tracks, I have some comparison tracks on Soundcloud. This one is the 03 versus a rosewood spruce OO normal scale - https://soundcloud.com/jpmist/compare-03-44?si=4a55cff90e604cf9bab0fb9cc4c284dc&utm_source=clipboard&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=social_sharing

The 05 is on another comparison track here with a Gretch OO and a Taylor 322 hog/blackwood, all 12 frets of course! - https://soundcloud.com/jpmist/test-track-05-g-322?si=1b13875f5442427287e1dff6383a8300&utm_source=clipboard&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=social_sharing

The flaw will be these were recorded with two different setups so you've given me something to do this week. I'll put together a brief comparison instrumental with the 05 and 03 so you can hear for yourself!

Finally got round to this...
To my ears, the 03 is preferable to the rosewood oo. But the best out of both clips by a country mile is the O5..

[William2]

I preferred the instrument you call the 44. It sounded more full and less harsh than the 03. On the second example, I preferred the Larrivee. Ther Gretsch instrument sounded really weak and that was true also of the Taylor in addition to the Taylors always strident treble register.

[jpmist]

To my ears, the 03 is preferable to the rosewood oo. But the best out of both clips by a country mile is the O5..

I preferred the instrument you call the 44. Sorry I left that that one off. g-man had originally asked about the cutaway vs non-cutaway.

Thanks for checking those out! Hopefully here's a better effort at comparison which I think you'll find interesting.
This .aiff audio file below is linked to my google drive which checks for virus's so it's safe.

So, no EQ, recorded with two mics about 16" away (about ear distance). I did two segments, the first are 4 chords by one guitar, then the same 4 chords by the second. I repeated that section and edited it so that you hear each of the 4 chords repeated by the second guitar immediately afterwards. My ear has a memory of about 2 seconds so hearing them back to back was useful to me. I did have to do some cleaning up on levels as to my surprise one guitar is about 15% louder than the other (!!!). The second segment is playing each open note, followed by the second guitar doing the same.

You guys might hate me for this but I'll leave off stating which guitar was which in order to take any and all bias out of the comparison. I'll check back in a day or two with which was 1st and 2nd.

I can hear some difference between the two guitars which I honestly find challenging to put into words. If you blindfolded me and dropped one or the other in my lap to play I doubt I could identify it accurately.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/182huFEbmteC0EYGiGCq1SJ-uQdo8vZTa/view?usp=share_link

[jpmist]

Just fyi for anyone interested, the first guitar of each of the three series was the short scale OOV-03 with satin sitka spruce top, cutaway and mahogany back and sides. The second is an all gloss OO-05 standard scale Italian spruce top with quilted mahogany back and sides. Both are similar in age and the strings were kinda old but equally so. . .

There are enough difference between the two that seem to indicate they should sound more different than they do. Quilted versus normal mahogany, the two different flavor spruce tops, the cutaway, the different neck scale, the different finishes so ????

I may repeat the experiment when I've changed the strings on both but am really surprised they sounded so similar in spite of the many subtle differences. Curious if anyone could tell the difference and am questioning now why I have two guitars that sound the same  . . .

[guitarman001]

I can hear the differences.
The 05 is warmer maybe owning to the Italian spruce top. I think it sounds a bit more complex, too.
TBH either would be fine depending on how I felt on the day (I say this as sometimes I love the warmth of mahogany but other days [most tbh] I prefer the edgier & more shimmery sparkle of my sapele).

I've got 3 mahogany backed guitars with the L going up for sale. In that case, the woods between that, the OM05 & P-03 really are exactly the same!

Thanks for going to the effort to do this!

[jpmist]

I can hear the differences.
The 05 is warmer maybe owning to the Italian spruce top. I think it sounds a bit more complex, too.
TBH either would be fine depending on how I felt on the day
Thanks for going to the effort to do this!

Thanks for checking it out! Kinda fun trying to pin down just how one guitar sound different from another. Educating my ears has been a long struggling goal of mine. Big flaw here are the year old strings but with 4 guitars they all averaged out the same amount of playing.

I chanced on the same file listening with speakers instead of headphones and that made a lot of difference differentiating the two - live and learn . . .

[guitarman001]

I need used to leave strings in for a long time. Then I got more and more guitars....... Lol