Happy Monday--Here's the deal. My Florida Correspondent and string advisor, Unclrob made me aware of something that was bothering me about the Larrivee Parlors I've tried. He likened their sound to a resonator, of course he was more poetic than I can be. So, he put his finger right on it. That's the sound that kind of hits me when I try these. Maybe I am expecting too much from a small guitar with flatpicking on my brain?
So, my question is this. Have people who own Parlors gotten used to the sound or tried to change it with strings? I am going back and forth between a Gibson Blues King or a Parlor. Plus, there is a nice Norman Folk that keeps drawing my untrained hands.
This just goes to show you how much help you can get on this forum. For some of you who have been playing for years I imagine this all seems trivial. But, I bought my first guitar less than two years ago and I am learning a lot because of the patience of the people at Larrivee and this Forum.
--Fred

Hey Fred,
      I don't own a parlor myself but have played quite a few. Fun little guitars they are, but I'm like you...I expected a little more I guess. Judging by their immense popularity and loyal fans I'm guessing they are an acquired taste. I followed some threads about parlors and noticed alot of people use them for travelling and also experiment with different/heavier/lighter string combinations. Bottom line for me was I couldn't justify spending the $$ on a guitar that didn't have a sound that suited my ears.

                     just my .02
                        Chris

I don't know, I guess I'm in the opposite camp. I can't put mine down and it has very quickly replaced my other guitars as my main practice guitar. The sound does grows on you. Maybe the tonewoods effect it more than on a larger guitar, so at least on my koa I like the sound. I wasn't that impressed with some of the others I have played...but then again I didn't buy them, but if I had, I'm sure the sound would have grown on me as well.

It also sounds really good plugged in. I installed an Ibeam in it, and that really brings it to life when I play in church and makes a nice counter sound to the other guitarists who typically play Taylors. I think the pickup brings up the bottom end of the guitar more than it otherwise is.

Andy

Hi fred I will give you my two cents.I one both a parlor and a blues king I love them both,but It would be like trying to compare a OM and a Dread, the king will always have a fuller sound no mater what you do to the parlor. For my parlor I use med. strings and tune down a half step which has given it a fuller sound.
       I have seen more than a few neg. comments on the blues king but that does not bother me,it looks great and sounds good.

Thanks Guys! Mark, have you taken your Gibson on any trips? I was amazed at the similarity in size.
Plus, the Koa and the rosewood Parlors seem to be the best sounding to me.

Anyone expecting a Larrivee parlor guitar to sound any bigger than it does is trying to make a dollar out of fifteen cents.  As a matter of physics the parlor sized body is limited sonically, no question about it.  I think the resonator comparison is justifiable--they certainly sound more boxy than a D, L, or OM body.

Having said all that, I think the Larrivee parlor reputation is well deserved.  When they first came on the market in the no frills version you could easily buy one at Guitar Center for right around $350, sometimes less.  Where else could you find an all solid wood guitar for that kind of price?  Nowhere.  That's how Larrivee sunk their hooks into the market.  Over the following couple years they started dressing the parlors up with some finer details--fancier tonewoods, maple binding, fretboard inlays, etc.--and the price went up accordingly, justifiably.  And the marketplace went right along with them, snapping up the snappier appointments, until now where they're only available in gloss finish.  

Perhaps it requires plunking down the $400-600 for a really nice, pre-owned satin finish Larrivee parlor guitar and spending time with it in order to acclimate to the sound.  But once you do--and the testimony is abundant--you come to love the sound, hearing the subtlties in it, all the while digging the superb playability, overall build quality, aesthetics, etc.

No one could ever expect a parlor guitar to be a player's only instrument--one's main stage axe--but it certainly is the couch potato's wet dream.  I still think it's one of the most brilliant guitar entries the market has ever seen.  More power to Larrivee.

Very well put honkytone, I couldn't have said it better.  I think once you own one of these little jewels, you quickly find certain styles and songs that cannot work with anything else.  It wouldn't be my first choice if I could only own one guitar but it comes in close for number two.  

Nothing barks like a Parlor! B)

I think the rosewood parlor has the least 'resonator-like' tone, the maple parlor the most.  But its the small body more than anything else.  The new high prices make this a moot point as you can buy a larger body for comparable money.  So it really comes down to whether you need or want a small guitar.  Lots of people use them for travel so they do have a place.

E. Shoaf

You guys make some excellent points. I'm not looking for a small guitar that sounds like a dread, I just wanted something with a little bigger sound so if I am going to play with someone at the other end of a trip, I can.
I have a Washburn Rover and, while it doesn't compare with a Larrivee, it is still a good sounding guitar. It's my camping guitar and I can leave it in the trunk without too much worry. At first it took some getting used to and now I like the sound.
A friend of mine has a folk size guitar that he gate checks if he flies and otherwise that is his road guitar. He also has a Baby Taylor for his small guitar.
Thanks, I'll keep you posted. I needed something to fret over today.
Fred

Fred,

There appears to be great body depth variation in the parlors. So far, the deeper bodied ones sound much better to me (although there might be other reasons for this, like woods and string choices).

I will have 4 parlors soon; maple, mahogany, koa, blackwood (on the way). SO I should be able to do some serious a/b'ing. So far, 3 different body depths, with the koa having the deepest body, and the best tone (to my ears).

I know, I need a rosewood and walnut to complete the set.  ;)  

Randy, you mean a difference in the Larrivee body depths? Wow, I never thought of that. I'll have to take that into account the next time I go hunting.  I've already figured that strings would make a big difference and Rob pointed me in the right direction. You must really like these little guys, Randy. That's a cool collection! I thought I was going to stop after I bought my D-03 until I played the LSV-05 and it followed me home. That puppy is too nice to take on the road.
Thanks for the education.

QuoteI need a rosewood and walnut to complete the set.  ;)

http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/...ead.php?t=58083 (http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=58083)

;)  

QuoteThere appears to be great body depth variation in the parlors.

I remember folks discussing that a while back.  How much variation are we talking about?  Does it correspond with when they were made?

Quote

QuoteI need a rosewood and walnut to complete the set.  ;)

http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/...ead.php?t=58083 (http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=58083)

I remember folks discussing that a while back. How much variation are we talking about? Does it correspond with when they were made?


;)

Thats Steve Lawson who's a member here too.

I think he may have posted pix of it at one time.

I really don't need another parlor....

What I need to do is pick out the one I like the best, and sell the rest...


Body depth varies from 3.5 to 4.5 (I don't have a 4.5 but had one confirmed to me with that depth) Here's the thread I tried to start on variations.
http://www.larriveeforum.com/forums/index....=3937&hl=parlor (http://www.larriveeforum.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=2&t=3937&hl=parlor)

Ok, now you  guys are getting into Rocket Science...this is what I like about this forum. What a wealth of knowledge. Thanks for that link, Honkytone. I had no idea they made a walnut version.
My small brain can only absorb so much, but I'm living this. :lol:
Thanks!
Fred

QuoteWhat I need to do is pick out the one I like the best, and sell the rest...

Body depth varies from 3.5 to 4.5 (I don't have a 4.5 but had one confirmed to me with that depth).

Amen to that.  Gotta stop all this buyin' and sellin'.

I had gone back and found your thread on parlor depth and was surprised by that 4.5" measurement.  Was that a satin or gloss finish?

I'm gonna measure my two parlors, along with one I sold to a buddy of mine, and report back.

Randy, if you are going to have 4 parlors soon you could be a valuable resource. Think of it, you could test strings on all 4 and charge us all for your results! :D
My wife would kill me if I had 4 parlors. In fact, what if she catches me on the computer even thinking about a new parlor? :o
I talked to Brian (what a great guy) at Larrivee and he told me he likes the rosewood the best. He told me Koa is a show wood, rosewood is for performance.
What a cool company.
Thanks for the interesting info everyone.
--Fred

Fredmando....I've got a satin all-Koa and this summer, also purchased a satin rosewood for my daughter.  I feel the all-Koa and Sitka/Rosewood difference is mainly due to the Sitka top on the rosewood.  The all-Koa sounds overall, warmer and "woody-er"; the rosewood has a bit more crispness to my ears on the high end.    An interesting comparison would be Sitka/Koa and Sitka/Rosewood.

I don't know about all the reported variances in parlor depths..I've seen both 4" and 4.5" quoted in various places.  I just measured my all-Koa and it's 4" deep at lower bout; 3 5/8" at upper bout.  Sorry, don't have the rosewood here with me..it's off at college getting educated..yeh, right!

Your ears may vary of course.  Rick

Fredmando,  My daughter and I have owned several Blues Kings.  I've heard good and bad, but our experience was great and I'd certainly recommend one if that's the sound you're after.  I was trying to duplicate an original L-00 and preferred the Gibson re-issue over other versions - some 2 or 3 times the $.  One main reason I don't still own one is my Larrivee Parlor.  On anything that doesn't really require a large guitar, the size, feel, and sound of my mahogany is just about perfect.  I also own an old resonator, but more often than not I reach for the parlor.  I'd agree that the maple version has the most resonator-like sound - to me a great thing.
If the parlor is close but not quite big enough, a Blues King might be an excellent choice.

Norton, I really would like to own both--a parlor and a Blues King. This is all very interesting because I always envisioned myself having three guitars max! I figured a Martin, a Gibson and a Larrivee. That dream has gone a little crazy and now I keep "finding" a reason for just one more.
Thanks again everyone...
Fred

I liked the sound of the parlor the first time I played one.  Tried out several when I was shopping for my OM, and would have loved to have been able to buy both the OMV-09 that I got and a parlor.  I was lucky enough to stumble across a used mahogany parlor just a few weeks after buying my OM and since I was looking for a travel guitar, I went ahead and bought it.  I play it at least, if not more, than my OM.  I like the sound and the size.  Apparently the sound doesn't suit all people, but hey, that's why there are so many guitars out there.  :D  

Are the Gibson Blues King and Larrivee Parlor really that comparable?  The former has a 25-1/2" scale, neck joint at 14th fret, retail price of $1,950, and street price of $1,350, new.  The Larrivee, of course, is short scale, 12 fret, and even in the new gloss finish $600 less than the Gibson.  Seems like two very different animals to me.

You're right, they are totally different other than the fact that they are both "smaller" guitars.
The Gibson has a longer scale than the Larrivee. I can see why some people have mentioned that they own both. I'm just trying to figure out which one I should buy.
I was more A and B'ing the guitars. I just don't know much about the Gibson other than what some of the members have offered.
I'm sure a parlor is in my future, but the Blues King I played is very nice and would be a great couch guitar as well as a travel guitar.
I already have a great knock around travel guitar that is laminated.
--Fred

QuoteBody depth varies from 3.5 to 4.5 (I don't have a 4.5 but had one confirmed to me with that depth) Here's the thread I tried to start on variations.
http://www.larriveeforum.com/forums/index....=3937&hl=parlor (http://www.larriveeforum.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=2&t=3937&hl=parlor)

OK, here's specs on the Larrivee parlors that have slipped through--or remain in--my hands:

Special Edition Rosewood #69875
Body width at neck joint:  3-1/2"
Body width at endstrip:  3-3/4"
No microdot inlays or ivoroid endstrip on fretboard

All Mahogany #70216
Body width at neck joint:  3-15/32"
Body width at endstrip:  3-11/16"
Ivoroid endstrip on fretboard but no microdot inlays

Special Edition Koa #71431
Body width at neck joint:  3-5/8"
Body width at endstrip:  3-7/8"
No microdot inlays or ivoroid endstrip on fretboard

Special Edition Blackwood #73486
Body width at neck joint:  3-9/16"
Body width at endstrip:  4-3/32"
Microdot inlays and ivoroid endstrip on fretboard

Special Edition Rosewood #75141
Body width at neck joint:  3-5/8"
Body width at endstrip:  4-1/8"
Microdot inlays and ivoroid endstrip on fretboard

It would seem in general that the bodies got deeper over the course of the run.  Of these listed, however, it's the all Mahogany (i.e., the least deep) that projects the best!  The fullest sounding and next loudest of them is the Blackwood!  Go figure.

Wow, this is amazing. This is some valuable research you have here. Great job.
Do I dare bring up the Blackwood again? It just seems to kick off a thread of it's own.  :o
Cool!
--Fred

QuoteWow, this is amazing. This is some valuable research you have here. Great job.
Do I dare bring up the Blackwood again? It just seems to kick off a thread of it's own.  :o
Cool!
--Fred

:ph34r:  

Going back to the original question of Parlors to Gibsons...would a more fair comparison be to the 00 size Larrivee's? These would be closer in price, although still a little cheaper, and have less of a 'boxy' sound to them. I think the Gibson's are modeled after an 00 also, aren't they? This might be more of an apples to apples comparison to judge two guitars by.

Andy

ps...I'm saving my pennies for an 00, could you tell?

Anyone seen Epiphone's version of the L-00?  Solid top and back (laminated sides, I guess), even comes with nickel Grover butterbeans!  And it's $600 less than the Gibson!  Cooler looking too in my book, nice pickguard and peghead:

http://www.epiphone.com/elitist/l00.htm (http://www.epiphone.com/elitist/l00.htm)

Whoa, wait a minute, now I'm seeing a $1,700 retail and $1,100 street price.  Nevermind... :unsure:  

Yep, there's two different models, the solid-top/laminated back Korean-made (?) cheapy (pretty, & not bad for the price IMO) & the Japanese-made Elitist , solid mahog back,altogether higher quality, but somewhat high-priced for an Epi (ie above their normal price-range & into Gibbo territory) tho some have compared them favorably to the Gibson equivalent; good bluesy tone..

Sorry way off the topic of parlors but since some are looking at the epis, the masterbuilt have also been getting great reviews.
These tow are particularly cool.
http://www.epiphone.com/default.asp?Produc...CollectionID=15 (http://www.epiphone.com/default.asp?ProductID=247&CollectionID=15)
http://www.epiphone.com/default.asp?Produc...CollectionID=15 (http://www.epiphone.com/default.asp?ProductID=222&CollectionID=15)
-josh

My maple bound mahog/sitka parlour has changed tone drastically in the past year or so.  Lost much of the boxiness (resonater) sound and has become much fuller.

I've noticed changes in tone on many other guitars and like this combo of woods for that reason.   but this parlour has opened far more than others i've owned.

Gret guitar.

Quote

Quote from: Randy_R,Jan 24 2005, 05:43 PMBody depth varies from...Of these listed, however, it's the all Mahogany (i.e., the least deep) that projects the best!  The fullest sounding and next loudest of them is the Blackwood!  Go figure.

I'll add the dimensions for my parlor to the bunch. It doesn't have a serial number and I was told by the seller that it was one of the first six made by Matthew  :blink:

Upper bout: 9 5/16 inch
Waist: 7 3/4 inch
Lower bout: 13 1/16 inch
Upper bout depth: 3 3/4 inch
Lower bout depth: 3 7/8 inch
Nut width: 1 11/16 inch
Fingerboard width at body: 2 1/16 inch
String width at bridge: 2 3/16 inch

This little parlor sure sounds good. I play it most of all just because it's always with me  :P

Gibsons and Larrivees are really different animals in both sound and feel.  Both good guitars, but completely different.

E. Shoaf

ps.    The parlours record extremely well.  High and sweet.  that small size boxiness makes for an excellent change in "texture".