Do you hate it , love it, don't even know what it is?
Mostly, I would like to hear others views on LSV's if you own one or have owned one, and if you have some insight from the Luthier view of them. Also, does anyone have any idea how many have been made? They seem to be pretty scarce.
I like mine a lot. And I won't say why so much yet, because I have said so much before anyway.
But the build on mine is up there with the Martin 45 series, not quite the bling level but it has that high of a quality in woods and build.
I added a few pictures this first one is just for fun, Danny
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Hi,
As I posted before, I've had a love/hate relationship with my LSV-11 for the last Year (we just had our first anniversary). I've come to the idea that the LSV-11s are great guitaers, but you have to be patient and get to know them. I'm the second owner and mine is now about 2 years old. The tone is much improved over this last year that I have owned it and I'll attibute at least a part of that to the wood beginning to open up. Both the Sitka top and the Rosewood back and sides on my LSV-11 are extremely tight grained, almost to the point of being "pinched". When I first got it, it indeed sounded very tight. It's now beginning to have a more rounded tone. It's also very possible that my ear is finally becomming more attuned to the tonal vagaries of this guitar.
It took me about 6 months to adjust to the short scale, but now I have no problem switching between my LSV-11 and my regular scale guitars. Speaking of the neck.........best I've owned, and am especially fond of that almost indescernable flat spot in the middle of the back of the neck. Also, 1 13/16 nut spacing with 2 1/4 saddle spacing is to my touch the best fingerstyle combination there is.
At first I was a little put off by the bling of the"vines" fret markers, but have come to really enjoy them. The vines certainly set this guitar apart frmm my other "abalone dot" guitars.
Right now, I'm on the "love" side of my LSV-11 realtionship, and see no reason for that to not continue.
Lastly, I'm mostly a "hog" guy, but if you have to have at least one Rosewood guitar in your stable, this is a pretty good one to have.
Gary
Thanks Gary that say's a lot of what I went thru and the point about the tight grain is a good one. Highly finished guitars do take a while to open and the grain being tighter may just extend that period of time. I hope we get a lot more input, this guitar is a bit of a "mystery". It would be really cool to hear from JCL or someone at Larrivee. Danny
The LSV11 is by far the most responsive and most comfortable for fingerstyle compared to my other guitars. The slightly wider string spacing, slim profile neck and shorter scale are an excellent formula. I've refrained from using it for a few days. "You don't know what you've got till it's gone" Joni Mitchell so well puts. More sustain would be nice; I think that as it opens up over time that will improve somewhat. It does have a nice woody tone. I can't comlain.
DAVE
Here are a few top pics so you can see the grain. Someone else can do a better job I'm sure. The grain runs straight and very tight along the top, thats a bit hard to make out. The gloss is so reflective I can't defeat it with my camera skills I just realized I am reflected in the lower one here
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This one has a lot of glare and the color is off but again it's the best I'm able to do. I just thought it might be time to show you me so here I am also. Danny
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Well mine is too new for me to be objective. I'm still in the honeymoon stage. I know exactly what you mean about the hot / cold thing mentioned.
As far as playability goes I think it is the perfect fingerstyle guitar. I love the short scale and the wide finger spacing.
It's also a beautiful guitar to look at. without being over the top blingy. That said...
I don't think the rosewood multi stripe binding is as nice as the maple binding. I like the contrast of the maple better. I do however, like how the blue grey strip ties in the color of the MOP inlay fretboard.
This is just picky stuff and not really important. It should all be about the sound. Mine has great sustain. I sometimes think it needs more volume. I usually play fingerstyle "naked" but with this guitar I feel tempted to play with picks. I think this may speak to the woody sound Dave mentioned. I think I see a p/up in this guitars future.
I like how it sounds most of the time. I was playing along with a CD, a tune I was try to work out, and I couldn't hear myself as clearly as when I do that with my other guitars. I love the sound when I am just quietly playing fingerstyle. I think sometimes maybe I'm expecting too much
Yikes!... I used honeymoon, naked and woody all in the same post. I wonder if I'll be censored. :roll feeble attempt at :humour:
I owned an LSV-11 for a little over a year before trading it. I really liked the feel of the guitar, but alas, I just could never get used to the tone. I can't really describe what was missing, but the guitar just didn't "have it" for me. I traded for a Martin OM-28 Marquis. I don't like the feel of the Martin as well as the LSV-11, but tonewise, this guitar "has it" in spades for me.
omozom, I really like the body binding, it fits this guitar. Some othe special Larri's have different bindings as well. I do like the maple a lot. But for this one I like the fine inlay lines and rosewood. The ivorioid being white was a concern to me, but I had forgot all about it until you mentioned the body binding. Danny
onozon,
I'll be interested to hear how the pick works out. Mine hates a pick, it gets all 'wolfy" and complains bitterly. I agree that this is not a guitar for playing in a mix, CD or otherwise. But, when it's late at night, and the whole house is quiet and it's just me and my LSV-11, those are truly special times that I've not know with another instrument.
Gary
Yeah! I'm sure I'll get to like it just fine. Probably after I get the OM-60 with the maple binding. :wink:
If you are talking about the ivoroid around the fret board. Mine is bone or even a little darker cream colored and I thought that was done very nicely. I was concerned because the photos I saw it looked very white. I was relieved when I opened the case.
Gary
Mine actually seems to like picks. I am using mediiums strings and I use pretty much a medium attack. (strumming)
Fingerstyle I had gone to just fingers but right after getting the LSV all my nails broke and I had to go to just using the skin part of the finger. I wasn't getting a good ring of the note. I then went to the Fred Kelly bumblebee thumb and Alaska pick on my other fingers. Better ring on th notes. but I had to get used to them all over again. I'm seriously thinking acrylics or something my nails break way to easy.
I think I'll start another thead on that subject.
Quote from: omozom on July 22, 2008, 01:23:56 PM
Yeah! I'm sure I'll get to like it just fine. Probably after I get the OM-60 with the maple binding. :wink:
If you are talking about the ivoroid around the fret board. Mine is bone or even a little darker cream colored and I thought that was done very nicely. I was concerned because the photos I saw it looked very white. I was relieved when I opened the case.
I just meant I would have prefered it be something dark colored to better match the Body binding. Here is a link to the Larrivee site and to the LSV-11; someone let me know if it does not work. http://www.larrivee.com/3_products/products_loadMovie/11%20series/LSV11/load%20movie/LSV11.html
Quote from: omozom on July 22, 2008, 01:57:42 PM
Gary
Mine actually seems to like picks. I am using mediiums strings and I use pretty much a medium attack. (strumming)
Fingerstyle I had gone to just fingers but right after getting the LSV all my nails broke and I had to go to just using the skin part of the finger. I wasn't getting a good ring of the note. I then went to the Fred Kelly bumblebee thumb and Alaska pick on my other fingers. Better ring on th notes. but I had to get used to them all over again. I'm seriously thinking acrylics or something my nails break way to easy.
I think I'll start another thread on that subject.
And you have EJ-17's for strings don't you? I have let 3 friends play my LSV with flat picks, all were carefull and all gave good reports on flatpicking and strumming. One was playing on a Maple Taylor jumbo with an Engleman spruce top (I forget the song we were playing) but I stopped him and handed him the LSV. He uses those really thick picks but he is a very good player and the song sounded much better on the LSV. That surprised me a bit.
Quote from: gary0319 on July 22, 2008, 01:23:31 PM
onozon,
I'll be interested to hear how the pick works out. Mine hates a pick, it gets all 'wolfy" and complains bitterly. I agree that this is not a guitar for playing in a mix, CD or otherwise. But, when it's late at night, and the whole house is quiet and it's just me and my LSV-11, those are truly special times that I've not know with another instrument.
Gary
I agree totaly with you Gary on playing solo when things are quiet. The tunes that come out in those times are also peaceful and very relaxing. I've played parts of two that I made up for family and friends and they like them. I described my LSV once as a gentle flowing mountain stream. Definetly not a roaring river or a waterfall. Danny
Have had my LSV for about two years now and it's also been love/hate -- but mostly because it's a very quiet guitar. Probably one of the BEST SOUNDING I've owned or heard, but the unamplified volume is relatively low.
That being said, it has opened up a lot over the past year, and different strings make a huge difference in the sound. We're now in the love phase...
Was actually planning to sell it around the beginning of the year after I got a "beater" guitar that had lots of volume (which I mistook for great sound...). My wife was very upset that I'd consider selling my "good" guitar, and after I went back and actually played it I realized "what WAS I thinking... this thing is great"
So my bottom line is that it has a great tone, I really appreciate the wider/shorter aspect of the neck, but that I would like more volume out of it. Does anyone know why these tend to be so quiet? Can't be the short scale alone since there are other short-scale guitars with lots of volume
Quote from: RoundLakeDT on July 23, 2008, 08:49:01 AM
Have had my LSV for about two years now and it's also been love/hate -- but mostly because it's a very quiet guitar. Probably one of the BEST SOUNDING I've owned or heard, but the unamplified volume is relatively low.
That being said, it has opened up a lot over the past year...
So my bottom line is that it has a great tone, I really appreciate the wider/shorter aspect of the neck, but that I would like more volume out of it. Does anyone know why these tend to be so quiet? Can't be the short scale alone since there are other short-scale guitars with lots of volume
This is what I have started to consider.
The heavy build/bracing
Forward shifting of the bracing losing a little more bass volume
The very tight wood grain in the top and thickness of the UV finish
The thinner body depth
The Larrivee build is a plus to me and I like the sound hole/waist being set closer to the neck joint. The thinner body is a must for me. (shoulder troubles)
So "Time" and playing to open the tonewoods are what will be the only factor (plus strings) that can cause more volume. I guess you could have the braces shaved and shaped a tad to change the volume. But I don't think many would do that.
It would be good to hear from some on these build factors. I would just like to know more from the specs. and technical side. Danny
Danny
Yes to the EJ17's. They are still pretty new. They sound great strummed and with finger picks and a little dull with just skin of the fingers. I hope my nails hurry up and grow. I have to dose up on the biotin in the mean time.
All this talk is making me wonder if 80/20's in medium would be the way to go. I read that 80/20's are the brightest sounding. In trying to attribute a sound to the LSV I would say the tone is a little on the dark side. Maybe 80/20's would add the sparkle I'm looking for.
Have any of you tried Medium 80/20's on the LSV? I'd be interested in your thoughts on the subject.
Quote from: dependan on July 23, 2008, 10:04:30 AM
This is what I have started to consider.
The heavy build/bracing
Forward shifting of the bracing losing a little more bass volume
The very tight wood grain in the top and thickness of the UV finish
The thinner body depth
... It would be good to hear from some on these build factors. I would just like to know more from the specs. and technical side.
Heavy bracing will definitly kill the sound. The more wood you have to move, the less the guitar will resonant.
'Forward shifting' should add to the bass and overall volume by loosening up the lower bout. It's funny Larrivee doesn't say where they shifted it to. We assume forward but how far forward... 1", 1/2", 1/32"?
The very tight wood grain in the top- This tells you that the top will either be flexible, stiff, or somewhere in between.
Thickness of the UV finish- Same idea as the heavy bracing but all the 05 and up series have this finish.
The thinner body depth- This will raise the resonant frequency which results in less bass and most likely a decrease in overall volume since less air is being pumped (all things being equal).
In addition you have a cutaway decreasing the size of the air chamber and less tension on the top due to the shorter scale.
I was hoping for this response since I am a novice at best in even talking about these issues. How about the larger sound hole? Thanks Jeremy, Danny
Quote from: jeremy3220 on July 23, 2008, 10:53:10 AM
Heavy bracing will definitly kill the sound. The more wood you have to move, the less the guitar will resonant.
'Forward shifting' should add to the bass and overall volume by loosening up the lower bout. It's funny Larrivee doesn't say where they shifted it to. We assume forward but how far forward... 1", 1/2", 1/32"?
The very tight wood grain in the top- This tells you that the top will either be flexible, stiff, or somewhere in between.
Thickness of the UV finish- Same idea as the heavy bracing but all the 05 and up series have this finish.
The thinner body depth- This will raise the resonant frequency which results in less bass and most likely a decrease in overall volume since less air is being pumped (all things being equal).
In addition you have a cutaway decreasing the size of the air chamber and less tension on the top due to the shorter scale.
Quote from: dependan on July 23, 2008, 10:58:04 AM
I was hoping for this response since I am a novice at best in even talking about these issues. How about the larger sound hole? Thanks Jeremy, Danny
It raises the Helmholtz resonating frequency of the guitar.
I went through about 6 or 7 different string types on my LSV-11. I never tried the mediums but tried all sorts of lights and custom lights. The 80/20's were definately brighter than the PB's. The three best for me were GHS Laurence Jubers, Martin SP 80/20 lights and custom lights, and my current favorite, Elixer Nanos custom lights 11/52. The custom lights seemed to give me more volume than the lights, go figure. Maybe it's becuse I have a really light touch and the 11/52's vibrate more for the given attack. Maybe the shorter scale needs lighter strings...........no idea, it just works that way for me.
Gary
Quote from: jeremy3220 on July 23, 2008, 11:24:44 AM
It raises the Helmholtz resonating frequency of the guitar.
:doh and what is that?
Quote from: dependan on July 23, 2008, 11:45:40 AM
:doh and what is that?
It raises the pitch of the guitar.
http://www.phys.unsw.edu.au/jw/Helmholtz.html
Quote from: jeremy3220 on July 23, 2008, 12:55:42 PM
It raises the pitch of the guitar.
http://www.phys.unsw.edu.au/jw/Helmholtz.html
:roll
This isn't just your same old boring science stuff....
"The purely Helmholtz resonance can be investigated by keeping the body volume constant. When measuring this,
a common practice is to bury the guitar in sand :laughin:, to impede the swelling or 'breathing' of the body. However, guitars are not usually played in this situation. :roll So the Helmholtz calculation will give an overestimate of the frequency of resonance for a real, flexible body"
I stopped reading at that point, funny stuff, though I'm sure it is being done by some one. Maybe the same kinda folks that put guitars in trees. Danny
Quote from: dependan on July 24, 2008, 11:17:16 AM
:roll
This isn't just your same old boring science stuff....
"The purely Helmholtz resonance can be investigated by keeping the body volume constant. When measuring this, a common practice is to bury the guitar in sand :laughin:, to impede the swelling or 'breathing' of the body. However, guitars are not usually played in this situation. :roll So the Helmholtz calculation will give an overestimate of the frequency of resonance for a real, flexible body"
I stopped reading at that point, funny stuff, though I'm sure it is being done by some one. Maybe the same kinda folks that put guitars in trees. Danny
I haven't read the whole thing either. It just happens to offer an explanation of Helmholtz resonance. You can test this be making a cardboard ring and placing it over the soundhole as to make the soundhole smaller. The guitar will lower in pitch.
Kind of off the main topic but this discussion and article on Helmholtz made me think about this. The other day I was working on a particularly tough new pattern and chord transition. It was taking a lot of concentration to get my fingers to work right. I had to really slow down the pattern and was looking closely at my picking hand. Well I rested my chin on the guitar where the upper bout begins it's curve to the finger board and very close to the binding at the front edge. The resonance through my jaw and to my ears was incredible. I loved the tone.
I mean it makes perfect sense it just Tickled me that all. Just some of the crazy stuff that goes through my mind while I'm waiting for my next shot to be set up.
Now back to our regularly scheduled program. :wacko:
QuoteI mean it makes perfect sense it just Tickled me
Yea man, its all about GOOD VIBRATIONS :thumb
We learned that back in the 60s
here is what the Beach Boys said about it in 1967
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEGmd-3Gg-s
Recently scientists discovered that the earth ' hums ' with a low frequency vibration.
They don't know why. The speculation is it might be ocean currents or waves coming ashore.
Let's hear it for GOOD VIBS man :bgrin:
- Larry the 60s guy
Quote from: dependan on July 21, 2008, 08:24:18 PM
Do you hate it , love it, don't even know what it is?
I've played one and loved it! If it didn't have electronics and/or the side shaved thin for later electronic installation, I would have bought it in a heartbeat. The sound didn't seem soft or low to my ears. The balance of highs, mids, and lows was perfect. Easily the best value in a small body guitar I've played.
It seems strange to have a pricy guitar like the LSV-11 and not be in love with it at first strum and then six months later when the strings are getting old. The vibe of the guitar is still there.
My Martin D-18GE sounded wonderful out of the box and still does 6 months later, with the SAME strings that it came with (I'm lazy that way). No waffling here. The GE pushed THREE other acoustics out of the house (that almost paid for it).
Seriously, don't force yourself to love the guitar. The LSV-11 is a good guitar, but is it great enough for you? I'd say if not then let someone else take over.
Quote from: prof_stack on July 25, 2008, 11:56:37 AM
It seems strange to have a pricy guitar like the LSV-11 and not be in love with it at first strum and then six months later when the strings are getting old. The vibe of the guitar is still there.
My Martin D-18GE sounded wonderful out of the box and still does 6 months later, with the SAME strings that it came with (I'm lazy that way). No waffling here. The GE pushed THREE other acoustics out of the house (that almost paid for it).
Seriously, don't force yourself to love the guitar. The LSV-11 is a good guitar, but is it great enough for you? I'd say if not then let someone else take over.
Different strokes I guess. I'm changing strings on my OM-21 Martin right now, also cleaning it up and thinking about making a bone saddle. The reason I'm saying something about my Martin is that it wasn't love at 1st strum for me on this guitar either. Actually the stories have been similar. It grew on me and I finaly got it. There are 4 other guitars that I bought earlier this year that were "1st strum" purchases, 3 are gone now and one is going to be for sale soon. The LSV-11 is not like any other guitar I have ever played. I liked it the 1st time I saw it, but I didn't care for the wide neck. Now other guitar necks don't feel quite right. Can't totaly explain it. Danny
O.K. I got home early today and decided to try some things I hadn't tried yet with the guitar.
This weekend I'm getting some strings to try out. But I don't have any yet and I couldn't wait for that so here is what I did.
First I put the guitar through my amp, Via a mic. I don't have a pick up currently for the LSV. Since my only complaint has been about volume or (I don't want to say dull) but maybe low key or mellow sound would be better; I really wanted to hear the guitar through the amp. With bare fingers, (remember my nails are gone) of course the volume was improved. But the guitar still sounded "mellow". I then put on some picks and the guitar just came to life. I first started with thumb, index and middle with Alaska picks. Great improvement!
The way I hold my picking hand the thumb pick does not meet the string flush. Since the Alaska's are trimable I may have just trimmed them a little off. I'm not getting a scratchy sound across the wound strings; it's more like a subtle click. The index and middle were fine. I should tell you that I don't use the metal picks. All are whatever plastic the company uses. I think they are delrin. So I decided to go to the F.K. Bumble Bee on the thumb. Subtle improvement. At first I thought I had it. But after closely listening there was still a slight clicking sound on the bass notes. Then I tried the F.K. speed picks. At first I couldn't play very smoothly with them. So I tried to trim them down more that I had before. This helped and I was able to play a decent rolling pattern to make an assessment. While I like the way the speed pick feels the click sound slightly increased over the Alaska and the Bumble bee. Right now I'm thinking of staying with the Bumble bee on the thumb and the Alaska's on the other finger. Oh yeah this is about the LSV-11, I think I'm in the wrong thread!
Well just to stay on topic...
The LSV sounded incredible! I think once my nails grow back, my finger tip / nail method will be just what I have been looking for . I love this guitar. The sound is there. You just have to figure out the best tech. to coax it out. I can't wait to go out and buy some strings. To see where that path leads us.
New LSV user... no regrets here! :thumbsup :nice guitar: :thumbsup
omozom, you started the picking thread after posting here, so it all blends together.
Quote from: jeremy3220 on July 24, 2008, 11:29:16 AM
I haven't read the whole thing either. It just happens to offer an explanation of Helmholtz resonance. You can test this be making a cardboard ring and placing it over the soundhole as to make the soundhole smaller. The guitar will lower in pitch.
Jeremy, I appreciated the comments and link, it just made me laugh when I read about the burial and most guitars aren't played this way etc. It still seems funny to me.
Here is a quote from the 12th fret on the LSV
" Did I mention that this thing was an absolute dream to play? The short scale makes even close-voiced chords easy to grip! There has obviously been some considerable thought given to the ergonomics of this particular model ... it just sits on your lap and falls into the perfect playing position! " Then he said
I LOVE THIS GUITAR Here is the link to the whole write up. It's good stuff. (I'm not a salesman) http://www.12fret.com/new/larrivee_LSV-11_fingerstyle_pg.html