Tonal Considerations of Bridge Placement

[William2]

I own 12-fret and 14-fret Larrivee instruments. I find the 14-fret instrument has more focus and sustain while the 12-fret instrument seems more open sounding and has a bit less sustain. I attribute the 14-fret instruments qualities to having the bridge on the X bracing. Looking at other makers 12-fret instruments (Martin & Iris), it looks like they merely build up the upper bouts to the 14th fret while leaving the bridge in the same place as their 14-fret instruments. Not having played either of these makers 12-fret instruments, wonder if their 12-fret instruments (not actually moving the bridge back) have the more focused and sustained sound than a 12-fret instrument where the bridge is actually moved back and off the X bracing. Anybody have any thoughts on this?

[unclrob]

I also play both but my 12 fretter is a maple body and it gives a fairly strong bass when I play with a tuning.


keep smilin and keep dancin   

[B0WIE]

The "focus" comes from a drier sound with fewer overtones. The 12 fret bridge placement usually generates a richer sound. Each has their place.

Sustain isn't strongly affected, IMO. You may be hearing other things at play.

As far as other makers, I've not seen a lot of them faking it. Could just be the specific models you're looking at. Keep in mind the sound hole often gets moved out of necessity as bracing changes.

[teh]

Like Bowie said, you may be hearing other things at play.

This week I have had two of my 12 fret guitars out on their stands to play (Larrivee Forum VI and Martin 000). Here are several key differences that could have an impact on the tone, feel and playability of each:

LSV vs. 000 body
25.5 vs. 24.9 inch scale
Moonwood Spruce/Walnut versus premium Sitka/Mahogany (3 piece back and sides)
Solid vs. slotted headstock
Closed vs. open geared tuners
Satin vs. gloss finish
Venetian cutaway vs. non-cutaway
Anthem Dual Source (factory installed) vs. Fishman humbucking soundhole pickup
No pickguard vs. teardrop pickguard
18 months old versus 8 years old
Built during and flowing COVID shutdown versus built 5 years before COVID

The Martin also has 1/4 inch scalloped top bracing which is consistent with all 35 style models.

Both guitars were custom orders and the first time I played either of them was when I opened the case. The Forum VI was a perfect setup out of the box; Jim Holler fine tuned the setup on the 000. The quality, design and craftsmanship on both of these guitars is stellar. I actually visited the custom shop and have a picture of me with my unfinished 000 body and neck the week they were being fitted. Out the door, there was a $300 price difference between these two guitars.

I have to admit that I have taken an inspection mirror and flashlight and peeked inside the soundhole of each of my guitars. Since I can't read my tape measure with any degree of accuracy, I trust the information on the spec sheets. I should ask my son to record both guitars to determine the differences but my soon to be 68 year old ear is a poor judge of describing the differences in focus and sustain.

With the exception of my 12 fret Larrivee maple parlor, the rest of my guitars are all 14 fret (2 dreads, an OM and an LV (12 string)) and I played all of them (except the custom 12 string) before I bought them.

[William2]

The "focus" comes from a drier sound with fewer overtones. The 12 fret bridge placement usually generates a richer sound. Each has their place.

Sustain isn't strongly affected, IMO. You may be hearing other things at play.

As far as other makers, I've not seen a lot of them faking it. Could just be the specific models you're looking at. Keep in mind the sound hole often gets moved out of necessity as bracing changes.

Good points. I was only comparing my two Larrivee 40 series guitars. This morning I compared two Martins 12 and 14 fret 15 series guitars. There was a more open sound to the 000-15 SM compared to the 000-15 instrument. The bridge placement appeared to me to be in the same place so maybe the increase in the body of the 000-15SM was toe contributing factor. It was the same case when I compared tow Iris guitar models, the DF 14 fret and the DF-12 fret models. Again, there was that extending of the upper bouts to the 14th fret, but the bridges looked to be in the same place on each instrument. In both cases the 12-fret seemed more open sounding and the 14-fret sounded more focused to me. I do think the 12-fret instrument worked better for the fingerstyle player. So maybe there is more than one way to get this sound, either moving the bridge back or changing the body shape. Speaking to another comment on this post, I find it fascinating how Martin indicates the size of the braces on certain models. And I am also intrigued by the various bracing positions they use. I have to say that I am becoming a real fan of an all-mahogany guitar. I love that clear sound and that sustain.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlmSntxRkDk&t=385s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xf0aM1rLSto&list=FLS3tqXJPPAJqoixuwOYW9yg&index=49