New buttons for ping tuners

[Danny]

 I have some sloppy MOP tuner buttons that I layered with stupid glue. I used the "ultra gap filling" on the flat edges to make up the slop. A tight button would be easy to remedy with a jeweler file. Or even a good exacto knife.
 If anyone gets those tite ones and doesn't want them, I'll buy em. Always ready for a challenge

[AZLiberty]

The link that I quoted you on should be the right size.
Hole:4.2mm(0.16") and 3.2mm(0.12")

These were a bit snug, but I used a light mallet to tap them in. VERY LIGHTLY. They do not come with the screws or washers. these are buttons only.

Thanks, looks like the ones I ordered are 10 thou smaller.  That's ok.  I can easily open them up with a drill index if needed, drilling smaller on the other hand, is kind of tricky.

[Daysailer]

.......
If anyone gets these working on the minis, please let me know!
Tad

Tad, I messed around some today with my gutars and buttons.
Metal buttons from L03 2004 Pings, fit all my guitars properly.
LS  F-III mini buttons fit on all my guitars properly.
Seagull mini buttons, (pings without index screw),  fit all my guitars properly.
Larrivee Ebony after market buttons from Larrivee store, fit all my guitars properly.
Ivoriod Grover rotomatic buttons from CrazyParts, fit all my guitar properly.
***ebony(iod) buttons that came on my Forum OM, are a sloppy fit on all my guitars, including my OM.
***these buttons are Schaller shape, thicker that the Larrivees.
***these buttons have a recess in the screw shaft that has a small spring and extra washer at the screwhead end.
***Sloppy fit that can not be tightened and corrected with the screw tension only.  Will need to shim somehow or replace.

FQMS has mini Grovers, real ebony for under $20 per 6.  I wonder if these have the same axel as the regular size like the pings seem to have, regular v mini.         http://www.firstqualitymusic.com/p_GRO-2050E/Grover-Mini-Ebony-Buttons-Set-of-6.aspx

Hope this helps.  

[Daysailer]

The link that I quoted you on should be the right size.
Hole:4.2mm(0.16") and 3.2mm(0.12")

These were a bit snug, but I used a light mallet to tap them in. VERY LIGHTLY. They do not come with the screws or washers. these are buttons only.

Thanks.  Those dimensions are the closest to my eyeball with small ruller, and drill bit experiments to what the pings shaft size is.

5/32" X 4/32".   or
.1562" X .125"    or
3.97mm X 3.18mm

If anyone has a good accurate dial or digital caliper, could you take these measurements of the shaft size and post them for us ???
I'm too cheap and very seldom need to be this precise.   Thanks in advance.

ds    

[Danny]

Thanks, looks like the ones I ordered are 10 thou smaller.  That's ok.  I can easily open them up with a drill index if needed, drilling smaller on the other hand, is kind of tricky.

Thanks.  Those dimensions are the closest to my eyeball with small ruller, and drill bit experiments to what the pings shaft size is.

5/32" X 4/32".   or
.1562" X .125"    or
3.97mm X 3.18mm

If anyone has a good accurate dial or digital caliper, could you take these measurements of the shaft size and post them for us ???
I'm too cheap and very seldom need to be this precise.   Thanks in advance.

ds    

If y'all open these up with  a drill bit you will wind up with buttons that spin and don't tighten your strings. Maybe not today, but in a few months for sure.

   These shafts have flats on them and your drill bits won't make any flats....

[Daysailer]

If y'all open these up with  a drill bit you will wind up with buttons that spin and don't tighten your strings. Maybe not today, but in a few months for sure.
  These shafts have flats on them and your drill bits won't make any flats....

Hey Danny, I'm not trying to drill buttons out.
I am only useing drill bits as feeler type guages to see how large the hole in the buttons are for reference. Both dimensions. Long and flat sides
Then using jewelers loupes and 1/64" graduated mini rulers I am measureing the long and flat side dimensions of the tuner axle.
(to the best tired eyes can)

If someone could do and outside caliper measurement on the 2 different dimension of the tuner axle, long AND flat side.
And then do an inside measurement of the button holes, same two, long and flat,  then  we would  know for sure.
If I wasnt stuck at home recovering from a recent surgery and I had an extra $45 I would go buy the tool myself.
ds

[Danny]

Hey Danny, I'm not trying to drill buttons out.
I am only useing drill bits as feeler type guages to see how large the hole in the buttons are for reference. Both dimensions.
Then using jewelers loupes and 1/64" graduated mini rulers I am measureing the long and flat side dimensions.
(to the best tired eyes can)

If someone could do and outside caliper measurement on the 2 different dimension of the tuner axel, long AND flat side.
And then do an inside measurement of the button holes, same two, long and flat,  then  we would  know for sure.
If I wasnt stuck at home recovering from a recent surgery and I had an extra $45 I would go buy the tool myself.
ds

OOPS....  OK  I can do that in the morning when my old eyes have time to recover. Obviously I can't even read the posts correctly, let alone my calipers. 

[Daysailer]

    Me too but the drugs are my excuse  ....   oxy somthing....

Playing on    do da,,,, do da....  

[AZLiberty]

Thanks, looks like the ones I ordered are 10 thou smaller.  That's ok.  I can easily open them up with a drill index if needed, drilling smaller on the other hand, is kind of tricky.

Buttons showed up today. And yes I ordered ones with too small a hole.  These have a nice metal insert in them and it's not the sort of thing that could easily be modified.  OK, I could modify them with an end-mill I suppose, or a jeweler's file and way, way more patience than I have.

These were the only Schaller style the seller had listed, and I screwed up by not double checking the hole size.  Actual hole size measures at .154 x .108.

I've checked every 6-string guitar I own, and they will not fit older Gotohs or Pings, or Ping Minis.

Seller shipped quickly, and included 7 buttons which was a very nice touch, and I feel very confident that he would do so again should I find the right size buttons.  Most of his product seems to be the smaller size though.

I have a new guitar showing up on Friday with Gotoh 510s on it.  If they fit tht one great, otherwise I'll make them available here at a very good price.

-Mark

[Daysailer]

You did get quick shipping.
Sorry to hear that they did not fit.   

Mark,  His site described a return policy in case you want to go that way instead of selling.


I ordered some of his ivoriod buttons that listed the larger hole size about 5 days ago,
and just got the Paypal notification today.  ???

I also ordered some Ebony Grover, full size and mini buttns from FQMS.
I'll keep y'all informed how they fit when they get here.
ds

[Danny]

Buttons showed up today. And yes I ordered ones with too small a hole.  These have a nice metal insert in them and it's not the sort of thing that could easily be modified.  OK, I could modify them with an end-mill I suppose, or a jeweler's file and way, way more patience than I have.

These were the only Schaller style the seller had listed, and I screwed up by not double checking the hole size.  Actual hole size measures at .154 x .108.

I've checked every 6-string guitar I own, and they will not fit older Gotohs or Pings, or Ping Minis.

Seller shipped quickly, and included 7 buttons which was a very nice touch, and I feel very confident that he would do so again should I find the right size buttons.  Most of his product seems to be the smaller size though.

I have a new guitar showing up on Friday with Gotoh 510s on it.  If they fit tht one great, otherwise I'll make them available here at a very good price.

-Mark

I just measured the standard Larrivee Ping shaft size and got .154 X .136 The shaft length is about  .300 with a plastic washer and a spring metal washer that are about .045.
               I think the mini Pings are the same as far as the shaft radius and flat .154 X .136 aprox.

[tadol]

I've checked every 6-string guitar I own, and they will not fit older Gotohs or Pings, or Ping Minis.

Thats what I found as well. I hope the other size works -

[AZLiberty]

  I just measured the standard Larrivee Ping shaft size and got .154 X .136 The shaft length is about  .300 with a plastic washer and a spring metal washer that are about .045.
               I think the mini Pings are the same as far as the shaft radius and flat .154 X .136 aprox.

The shafts on my 1998 OM-03R measure .161 x .127.  I have no idea if they are Pings or Gotohs.  I thought Larrivee was using Gotohs at the time and switched to Pings at the same time they switched to the new truss rods (also made by Ping).  I didn't measure the Ping minis on the Parlor, but they looked a bit fatter.

The tuners on my Tacoma say GOTOH across the back, so that one is obvious. 

I really like these buttons, they are almost the exact shape as the old Schaller type buttons.  I might try using a .125 drill in the drill press, hitting it twice at the edges of the metal insert, and then clean up the difference with a jewelers file to square up the sides.  Otherwise, at $12 plus $5 shipping it's acheap enough lesson.

[Big Eric]

Okay, stupid query here - on my L-01, would the tuners be Ping?  They are marked Larrivee on the back, and seem to operate a lot smoother than the Pings I've had on other guitars.  The truss rod is probably the new style, though.  As it can be adjusted with the modified L shape tool.  Not the J shape.

Contemplating swapping to ebony buttons on this guitar.  Good thread.

[cke]

Okay, stupid query here - on my L-01, would the tuners be Ping?  They are marked Larrivee on the back, and seem to operate a lot smoother than the Pings I've had on other guitars.  The truss rod is probably the new style, though.  As it can be adjusted with the modified L shape tool.  Not the J shape.

Contemplating swapping to ebony buttons on this guitar.  Good thread.

Not 'stupid ?'  tuners are a confusing rambling subject.
Tuners marked "Larrivee" are Pings.

[AZLiberty]

Not 'stupid ?'  tuners are a confusing rambling subject.
Tuners marked "Larrivee" are Pings.

I thought Gotoh also made Larrivee marked tuners back in the mid 90's.  Obviously anyone as large as Larrivee or Taylor can get their name stamped on any tuner simply as part of a large purchase agreement.

You know what would be really, really, handy, is for someone to measure the shaft size on some Schaller S6 tuners, some Gotoh 510s, some Gotoh "Schaller Style", Grovers, Ping Mini's, Grover minis etc, compile the info, and we could get one of the mods to sticky it at the top of the technical forum. (if the info is out there, my Google-fu is too weak to find it)

-Mark

[cke]

I thought Gotoh also made Larrivee marked tuners back in the mid 90's.  Obviously anyone as large as Larrivee or Taylor can get their name stamped on any tuner simply as part of a large purchase agreement.

You know what would be really, really, handy, is for someone to measure the shaft size on some Schaller S6 tuners, some Gotoh 510s, some Gotoh "Schaller Style", Grovers, Ping Mini's, Grover minis etc, compile the info, and we could get one of the mods to sticky it at the top of the technical forum. (if the info is out there, my Google-fu is too weak to find it)

-Mark

Very good idea! Trying to get a clear idea of what is what and what fits what would be very useful.  

And soorry I didn't know about the earlier Gotoh/Larrivee's.

[AZLiberty]

And soorry I didn't know about the earlier Gotoh/Larrivee's.

As I recall, and I could be completely wrong,  Larrivee used Gotoh's after they quit using Schallers and before they started using Pings.  Gotoh makes a "Schaller Style" tuner that looks almost exactly like the current Pings.

From stewmac:


But, there is no information on the shaft size. 

[AZLiberty]

I'll start.

Gotoh Mini 510 Tuners.  Button Shaft = .160" x .125"

[Mr_LV19E]

I'll start.

Gotoh Mini 510 Tuners.  Shaft = .160" x .125"

By shaft, do you mean the part that the knob goes on?  Is it two different diameters?