(I'm assuming this is the best forum for this topic...)
I have several guitars I'd like to sell - downsizing because I don't play them all (that much), and trying to simplify and get "down to" 4 (maybe 5) steel string acoustics, a couple nylon strings, and @ 6-8 electrics (crazy, I know! Right now I've somehow accumulated @ 25-30 guitars!!!).
But the market is still tough on sellers - it's hard for me to want to part with some of these guitars. It's not even that I need the money - as much as I need the simplicity in my life. But selling some of these for "giveaway" prices makes me think, well - I might as well keep them and play them (once in awhile).
Anyone else struggling with this?
Buyers market. Way more guitars and other instruments available then people willing to pay for them. I've been offering a Larrivee all mahogany soprano uke for sale for about half the price as a new one. Except for someone who was interested but wanted geared tuners, not a sniff. The friction tuners work very well and tuners can be replaced very easily but ... go figure. Unless one is desperate, I agree, might as well keep 'em. That's been my decision.
You are not kidding, they are very hard to sell for a reasonable price much less what they are really worth. I am going to wait and just hang on to them until the market improves, even if I have to move them all home to Texas in March when I retire again. At least it will give me something to do...
Yep - I'm in the boat with you, except I need to get from 6 down to 3. I have seen some absolute steals over on the AGF. It is hard to accept selling for 50% of what you paid, especially when you bought at what was a fair price in the first place.
Chas
I've got the same issue with wishing to downscale from 7 to maybe 2 or 3. I'm hoping the market will improve but given the demographics I doubt if it will. With the Asian imports and the eventual demise of the baby-boomers (with all those guitars) it spells for a very poor used guitar market for some time. I guess I will hold onto to them as I, like the rest of you, hate to just give them away at these ridiculous prices. It's a good thing I've got plenty of room under my bed. :whistling:
Quote from: Chasjax on October 13, 2016, 04:50:04 PM
Yep - I'm in the boat with you, except I need to get from 6 down to 3. I have seen some absolute steals over on the AGF. It is hard to accept selling for 50% of what you paid, especially when you bought at what was a fair price in the first place.
Chas
50% is actually a pretty good price unless you have a vintage instrument. Mostly you won't even get an offer that you wouldn't laugh at. My favorite is ... "Will you take $XXX.00 ... CASH?" I usually answer, "Well I was hoping for magic beans ..." :laughin:
Quote from: ducktrapper on October 13, 2016, 05:15:17 PM
50% is actually a pretty good price unless you have a vintage instrument. Mostly you won't even get an offer that you wouldn't laugh at.
Indeed...when I watch the sales right here (in the for sale and trade forums), I just shake my head as people bump their post to lower the price on a regular basis. Some very nice guitars going for ridiculously low prices.
Makes me wonder what else besides guitars do you see devaluing as Boomers age? Motorcycles :?
Yes, it has been, currently is and will remain (for perhaps a decade at least) a buyer's market for acoustic guitars. Of course, there are a few and far between exceptions. I'm quite comfortable now with my little group of guitars, but I am selling one (a great Webber) which simply isn't moving at all. I do want to add one to the herd - an all koa mid sized instrument. I'd almost go for a Martin 000-28K 1921, but the 1 7/8" nut width spooks me a bit. Some used prices for that instrument are acceptable (low $3k range). The used Collings, Froggy and Santa Cruz all koa instruments I've seen for sale are all in the "this is what I (seller) thinks it should be worth" level.
As to Larrivees, used prices on -03 models are what they have always been. They weren't that expensive to begin with. Higher models appear to have some dropoff, but not that much.
Trade up for a nicer guitar and you could downsize that way. I agree, though. Used guitar market is flooded.
Mikeymac, what kind of guitars do you have for sale? Thanks
When
1. The economy improves
2. Some new good guitar bands appear
3. Young people can find jobs
Then maybe prices will improve.
Quote from: Walkerman on October 14, 2016, 09:19:42 AM
When
1. The economy improves
2. Some new good guitar bands appear
3. Young people can find jobs
Then maybe prices will improve.
Steve, I would add when the elections are over to your list of probabilities...
I really believe there will be no recovery in the used guitar market. Baby boomer bubble has bust. There's a glut of good guitars on the market. I bought twenty guitars between 1994 and 2013. Then I retired and haven't bought one since and probably won't, at least, not in the near future. The new guitar market will pick up but used? Way too many guitars and way too few new buyers. Prices will remain flat.
I agree, Ducktrapper, that there likely won't be a recovery in the used guitar market, but why do you think that "prices will remain flat?" Thousands (tens of thousands?) of quality guitars are added to the nation's guitar inventory every year and, almost certainly, fewer are removed through accident or otherwise. Yet I see no evidence that there's enough increase in demand to keep prices "flat." Younger folks play electric, play keyboard, or, most often, just listen to music.
Certainly prices in collector markets do go up as well as down, e.g., exotic cars, fine art, coins and postage stamps. But most of us are not dealing with collectable guitars -- rather, we have, and occasionally try to sell, excellent, well-constructed guitars that can produce great music and were constructed by first-line factories or good luthiers. It's easy to feel that the marketplace should treat us better. But . . .
This thread began with a complaint that the marketplace for used guitars does not reflect their true value. In reality, every active marketplace establishes a value that accommodates both buyers and sellers. So we sellers of used guitars need to either hope that the marketplace has a change of heart (really?) or recognize that times change -- and the prices that now prevail in the used guitar marketplace are a measure of that change.
Does anyone want to buy my used, but really excellent, concertina? I've priced it "fairly." :donut :donut :coffee
I've had the same guitar for sale for 5 years now with different sale price's and even then I only get stupid offer's.Its still for sale now,it is vintage,it is priced fairly and it come's from a good home and heritage.
Quote from: unclrob on October 14, 2016, 01:41:35 PM
I've had the same guitar for sale for 5 years now with different sale price's and even then I only get stupid offer's.Its still for sale now,it is vintage,it is priced fairly and it come's from a good home and heritage.
And your perseverance and patience will eventually pay off. Some day the right buyer will come along and find you...
Quote from: yellowesty on October 14, 2016, 01:32:54 PM
I agree, Ducktrapper, that there likely won't be a recovery in the used guitar market, but why do you think that "prices will remain flat?" Thousands (tens of thousands?) of quality guitars are added to the nation's guitar inventory every year and, almost certainly, fewer are removed through accident or otherwise. Yet I see no evidence that there's enough increase in demand to keep prices "flat." Younger folks play electric, play keyboard, or, most often, just listen to music.
Certainly prices in collector markets do go up as well as down, e.g., exotic cars, fine art, coins and postage stamps. But most of us are not dealing with collectable guitars -- rather, we have, and occasionally try to sell, excellent, well-constructed guitars that can produce great music and were constructed by first-line factories or good luthiers. It's easy to feel that the marketplace should treat us better. But . . .
This thread began with a complaint that the marketplace for used guitars does not reflect their true value. In reality, every active marketplace establishes a value that accommodates both buyers and sellers. So we sellers of used guitars need to either hope that the marketplace has a change of heart (really?) or recognize that times change -- and the prices that now prevail in the used guitar marketplace are a measure of that change.
Does anyone want to buy my used, but really excellent, concertina? I've priced it "fairly." :donut :donut :coffee
I used the term "flat" in that they won't go up. You're right, however, they could go down. I agree that the market actually does reflect an item's true value. It's unfortunate and a little frustrating when the market values something less than you do. Especially when you're the one holding it. Definition of a buyer's market, I suppose.
In europe, the prices stay high. I've payed more for my rs4 than an new one when they were released.
Quote from: Davy Vanthuyne on October 14, 2016, 02:59:07 PM
In europe, the prices stay high. I've payed more for my rs4 than an new one when they were released.
Are we talking about big name US imports only or Euro made guitars, as well?
In general the big brands import but when the guitar isn't a standardmodel, the price is higher.
Just don't try to sell unless you need to due to financial hardship. Or, list what you think is a fair price and creatively market it for the long haul.
Quote from: Strings4Him on October 15, 2016, 03:42:37 PM
Just don't try to sell unless you need to due to financial hardship. Or, list what you think is a fair price and creatively market it for the long haul.
Sometimes I think the bargain basement pricing we are seeing is because folks need the money in this hard times economy? I am holding out for better days...
Quote from: Mikeymac on October 13, 2016, 04:23:59 PM
Anyone else struggling with this?
Yes, it's been a serious "buyers market" for 8 years now. People don't just want a "deal" they want fire-sale pricing.
Also it seems that anything other than a Martin or Taylor takes forever to move.
Quote from: georbro3 on October 14, 2016, 10:03:02 AM
Steve, I would add when the elections are over to your list of probabilities...
Depends on which way the election goes.
Quote from: AZLiberty on October 15, 2016, 04:50:58 PM
Yes, it's been a serious "buyers market" for 8 years now. People don't just want a "deal" they want fire-sale pricing.
Also it seems that anything other than a Martin or Taylor takes forever to move.
Pretty much my experience as well. I buy and sell the odd used guitar from time to time. Bought and sold a Taylor GS Mini and a Martin 000-16gt over the summer. Both moved pretty quick and sold for good prices.
Even excellent Godin and Larrivee products have to be priced well and can sit for some time.
I think used prices in Canada have actually risen a bit lately for US built products as our fallen dollar has effectively caused new prices to increase by 30%.
I buy and sell every few months and I've had no trouble selling used guitars for more than what I paid. But, I'm definitely going to be playing it safer now and only picking up real steals because the market is in bad shape right now. I'm even at the limit of how many steals I can pick up because I'm out of room to store them.
Yesterday, I bought a near mint sunburst Fender Standard HSS Strat with a coil-tap switch (MIM) complete with a Fender hard case and a 15-watt Peavey Rage 158 amp. All for the asking price of $300.00 CAD. All it needs is a good setup which it obviously has never had done. The young fellow I bought it from got it as a gift from his dad, but never really played or learned to play it, apparently. These are usually the best deals.
Once I've set it up I'll either give it to my granddaughter as an upgrade to her Squire Strat or re-sell just the guitar for at least as much as I paid; and keep the case and amp.
Quote from: georbro3 on October 14, 2016, 10:03:02 AM
Steve, I would add when the elections are over to your list of probabilities...
Nah, as soon as the election is over everyone's free money will be used for more guns, ammo, and reloading supplies.
The economy is, "not great" might be the best way to put it. The official unemployment rate is at 5% (which is historically quite good) but that is the so-called U3 rate.
The U6 rate is around 10%, and that still only counts some, but not all part time employees who want full time work.
Also, psychologically, people are wary of spending money on non-necessities, as they still are gun-shy from all the lay-offs a few years back. I have employees who constantly are worried about future business even though the GM just bought a brand new Tesla and we just got a 220 million dollar 4-year factory order.
So yeah, used prices are in the toilet. Like I said earlier in the thread people don't just want a deal, but they want fire-sale pricing.
At a certain point, if I can't sell something for at least a nominal value I'll give it away to a friend.
12-string pricing is even worse. I still have that D-03R-12 for sale if someone wants to give me an obscenely lowball offer I can laugh at. :winkin:
Quote from: AZLiberty on October 31, 2016, 11:28:27 PM
At a certain point, if I can't sell something for at least a nominal value I'll give it away to a friend.
That too is what I do.
I am having the same struggles. Trying to simplify also- hoping to get down to 2. I am doing like many have suggested, just going to wait until either the right person comes or the market improves. I hate to see it when a guitar sales for an extremely Low price, which brings the market down. But I will have to say, if I have to have a problem...... too many guitars is not a bad one to have :thumbsup
Quote from: morrow22 on November 01, 2016, 05:06:18 AM
But I will have to say, if I have to have a problem...... too many guitars is not a bad one to have :thumbsup
This is true - and does put a lot of things into perspective. And the reason I (and perhaps others around here) have too many guitars is because there were some good years when we could afford to go a little crazy...
...but I will be listing some in the next week or two, including a couple Larrivees. I must confess I'm still curious about what the 50th Anniversary Larrivee guitar/s will be: I
WILL be tempted! :rolleye:
I am amazed at the price of Larrivees on eBay Japan. Thats where you need to sell. Got any friends who work in the sushi bar?
I'm not so sure the economy's to blame, or the election, etc. I think the problem is that there are too many guitars, both new and used,for the shrinking number of buyers. Think of all of us aging players that own five or ten or however many, then think of how many new players that are coming along. There are thousands of new guitars being built every day from inexpensive foreign models to very dear luthier guitars going unsold.
Quote from: nctom on November 01, 2016, 11:46:28 AM
I'm not so sure the economy's to blame, or the election, etc. I think the problem is that there are too many guitars, both new and used,for the shrinking number of buyers. Think of all of us aging players that own five or ten or however many, then think of how many new players that are coming along. There are thousands of new guitars being built every day from inexpensive foreign models to very dear luthier guitars going unsold.
A lot of merit to this position IMHO
Quote from: nctom on November 01, 2016, 11:46:28 AM
I'm not so sure the economy's to blame, or the election, etc. I think the problem is that there are too many guitars, both new and used,for the shrinking number of buyers. Think of all of us aging players that own five or ten or however many, then think of how many new players that are coming along. There are thousands of new guitars being built every day from inexpensive foreign models to very dear luthier guitars going unsold.
Quote from: JOYCEfromNS on November 01, 2016, 01:16:14 PM
A lot of merit to this position IMHO
Indeed.
Quote from: morrow22 on November 01, 2016, 05:06:18 AM
But I will have to say, if I have to have a problem...... too many guitars is not a bad one to have :thumbsup
Makes creative storage very useful. I picked up these ideas from the Larrivee factory, not exactly the same shelving, but exactly the same concept...
Quote from: georbro3 on November 01, 2016, 08:03:15 PM
Makes creative storage very useful. I picked up these ideas from the Larrivee factory, not exactly the same shelving, but exactly the same concept...
hmmm
Quote from: georbro3 on November 01, 2016, 08:03:15 PM
Makes creative storage very useful. I picked up these ideas from the Larrivee factory, not exactly the same shelving, but exactly the same concept...
:donut2 :coffee :donut :coffee
Geo...
I can help store all the L-bodies if you run out of room, free of charge.
Mike
L-05
As a rule, I buy guitars to play them, i don't have any other play toys (motor cycles, snow mobiles, fancy cars, etc.
I'm a professional musician who likes guitars, and I like to play them.
I doubt i would ever get close to what I pay for them, (except on a rare super deal), but I also have a couple on the market.
Only because if I don't play a particular guitar regularly, or I can't "bond" with it ( for a myriad of reasons) I'll part with it.
Yes "breaking even" is certainly a good bottom line, but having some-one else who wants to own/play something I can't is a good enough reason to let it go.
I recall my very first larrivee from 1972, and after owning it a very short time, an amazing player just made it sing, so he has it now (still).
Any, and all of us, who have more than one guitar, and can usually
decide which one to play in the house, on a sessions, on a gig is truly blessed with a very high quality of life, indeed.
Quote from: morrow22 on November 01, 2016, 05:06:18 AM
But I will have to say, if I have to have a problem...... too many guitars is not a bad one to have :thumbsup
True, but truth be told, I have way more guitars than I can play.
The guitar that gets more play time than anything is my O-01 parlor from 1999. It's just the right size for playing while sitting at the computer, or when writing new songs. Now I certainly wouldn't mind upgrading to a P-03 since the original 1 11/16" nut is a bit tight on that short scale, but I doubt I could sell it for a 1/3rd the price of an -03.
After that the guitar that gets the most play time is my OM-03R (still my favorite guitar after 18 years) or my Rainsong Shorty, which I always take when I play out. Nothing like carbon fiber for staying in tune. I can go from Phoenix to San Diego and it's still dead on.
I really never play my Forum-III, or my D-03R-12, or Guild F-212. If I want to play 12 I play the Taylor or Rainsong instead. And as much as I like my Breedlove C20/SR it doesn't do anything that the OM-03R does not do.
And then the wife has several as well...
And all those wooden guitars need maintenance, even if it is just filling the humidifiers every couple of weeks.
So it's less about "needing to sell" than "could use some room". I'd love a little 00 Larrivee or Martin to add to the collection, but one of those other guitars needs to go first.
Quote from: AZLiberty on November 06, 2016, 12:14:50 PM
True, but truth be told, I have way more guitars than I can play.
The guitar that gets more play time than anything is my O-01 parlor from 1999. It's just the right size for playing while sitting at the computer, or when writing new songs. Now I certainly wouldn't mind upgrading to a P-03 since the original 1 11/16" nut is a bit tight on that short scale, but I doubt I could sell it for a 1/3rd the price of an -03.
After that the guitar that gets the most play time is my OM-03R (still my favorite guitar after 18 years) or my Rainsong Shorty, which I always take when I play out. Nothing like carbon fiber for staying in tune. I can go from Phoenix to San Diego and it's still dead on.
I really never play my Forum-III, or my D-03R-12, or Guild F-212. If I want to play 12 I play the Taylor or Rainsong instead. And as much as I like my Breedlove C20/SR it doesn't do anything that the OM-03R does not do.
And then the wife has several as well...
And all those wooden guitars need maintenance, even if it is just filling the humidifiers every couple of weeks.
So it's less about "needing to sell" than "could use some room". I'd love a little 00 Larrivee or Martin to add to the collection, but one of those other guitars needs to go first.
Your situation reflects mine very closely. Different specific guitar models, but same scenario. I have accumulated more guitars in total over time and the number never seems to decrease, only increase. I just can't resist a "good deal" whether or not I end up playing a new acquisition that much. I have at least a half dozen or more guitars that I could easily do without right now. Egads, I've become a guitar hoarder.
anything will sell for the right price, in the right market.
I was told, in my neck of the woods, real estate was bad.
I sold my house for close to asking with no difficulties.
Within the past 3 weeks I have sold two very lovely Larrivee guitars for full asking price, with the buyer paying shipping and fees.
Niether guitar was outrageously priced. Own fact both were priced a tad higher than similar guitars on the market.
As a Canadian, selling for USD is an added 30% of sale price.
Mind you buying guitars (in USD) is an added 30% of sale price as well. (plus an extra 15% tax/duty to get to my country).
I will concur, it's a buyers market for all the aforesaid reasons.
I guess we just wait until some-one wants our particular guitar....house, car, what ever...... :arrow
Generally speaking, it's been pretty much the case for some time now that you sell for about half what you paid unless it's a very desirable Martin model or a Froggy Bottom. Martin adirondack top 00's and any Martin HD still seem to fetch a good price. Larrivee's have a harder time in the used marketplace. I really don't know about other makes.
I think a lot of the problem is that there is so much fraud (people misrepresenting what they have). I have traded for two guitars and have been pleased with both transactions. I bought my Collings on e-bay at the "buy it now" price and feel that I bought it at the right price. My Larrivee was on consignment at Elderly and I paid the asking price (again, I'm satisfied with the purchase). My Schenk was purchased brand new and, again, I got what I wanted. If you want a bargain, go to a pawn shop; if you want a guitar, step up and pay the price for a good one. Make sure your not getting scammed, of course, but don't low-ball for a good one.
Quote from: ducktrapper on October 13, 2016, 05:15:17 PM
50% is actually a pretty good price unless you have a vintage instrument. Mostly you won't even get an offer that you wouldn't laugh at. My favorite is ... "Will you take $XXX.00 ... CASH?" I usually answer, "Well I was hoping for magic beans ..." :laughin:
Yeah, I hate it when people on Craigslist waste my time texting me, asking if I will take half what I'm asking for a guitar, especially since its usually already half what I paid for it! And then they want you to deliver it to them! I always swear I'll burn them first.