Tuning: 440 Hz to 432 Hz

[Silence Dogood]

I've been watching some YT videos on this and have listened to some of the music tuned to this lower pitch.  I'm not interested in the conspiracies that go along with the topic, but the sound is very intriguing.  I'm thinking of trying it out soon.  Have any of you messed around with this 432 tuning?

[jazzereh]

Firstly, good luck and hope you get something useful from this.  I've listened to some of the YT videos as well and would not say one 'sounds' better than the other to me.  Slight differences in the quality of the sound is the best way I would describe it. 

I guess if you don't play with others, this would be just something else to experiment with just as alternate tunings are.

Also interesting to note that there are orchestras in different parts of the world that use tunings different than 440.  If you were a journeyman musician and played in various orchestras, I imagine that would be a bit of a pain.  As to the audiences in each case noticing a difference, I highly doubt that.

Have fun.  Let us know if you hear anything or if you are inspired differently with either tuning.

[Silence Dogood]

I pretty much never play with others so there's no difficulty there.  I will need to get another tuner where I can set the pitch differently since my Snark defaults to 440.  I can definitely hear the differences in the sound examples
I've heard on YT.  The best way I can describe it is it's less bright but not darker: it's really just more lush and mellow overall, like the music breathes a bit more.  I dislike standard tuning and never use it because to me it sounds tight, stifled, and makes guitars harder to play and therefore less enjoyable.  YMMV.  So something like this is of interest to me.

[mike in lytle]

I pretty much never play with others so there's no difficulty there.  I will need to get another tuner where I can set the pitch differently since my Snark defaults to 440.  I can definitely hear the differences in the sound examples

I've had a number of Snark and D'Addario tuners (I lose things) and they all could be adjusted. The D'Addario on the front and the Snark on the back.
However, I have not done anything with 432, unless it was by accident.
Mike

[B0WIE]

Briefly tried it but that resulted in zero interest from me as it wasn't "better" in any way, and I don't want to throw off my ear. I'm far from having perfect pitch but I sing, so screwing with my throat's muscle memory is not something I want to do. I know plenty of people can with no problem but I've worked really hard to develop a decent sense of pitch and wouldn't benefit from changing. I use alternative tunings all the time to get a different/better sound, but all based on 440.

YouTube can be amazingly helpful but it's also a wellspring for bad info. For me, the arguments for switching are massively dwarfed by the fact that most things are in 440.

Let us know how it works out for you though! It's always good to experiment

[Queequeg]

I pretty much never play with others so there's no difficulty there.  I will need to get another tuner where I can set the pitch differently since my Snark defaults to 440.  I can definitely hear the differences in the sound examples
I've heard on YT.  The best way I can describe it is it's less bright but not darker: it's really just more lush and mellow overall, like the music breathes a bit more.  I dislike standard tuning and never use it because to me it sounds tight, stifled, and makes guitars harder to play and therefore less enjoyable.  YMMV.  So something like this is of interest to me.

You might possibly be a good candidate for a baritone.
Ever played one?

[Silence Dogood]

You might possibly be a good candidate for a baritone.
Ever played one?

Wow, great idea.  I've never even seen one in person much less played one.  I did have an octave mandolin for a while.  It got old quick.

[Queequeg]

Wow, great idea.  I've never even seen one in person much less played one.  I did have an octave mandolin for a while.  It got old quick.

I've heard some people say that about baritones, too. "It got old quick".
Not for me, though. I love the baritone. Reminds me so much of a cello. I only play instrumentals, though. Singers may not like it quite so well, maybe.
It's tuned a 4th below the guitar, so B to b.
But I use all my open and altered tunings on it.
To my ear it sounds best on traditional and slower tunes.
I play some Celtic and DADGAD stuff on it and prefer some of them to guitar.
It sounds great on "Shenandoah". Also "A Whiter Shade Of Pale" (if you like those tunes).

[mike in lytle]

I've been watching some YT videos on this and have listened to some of the music tuned to this lower pitch.  I'm not interested in the conspiracies that go along with the topic, but the sound is very intriguing.  I'm thinking of trying it out soon.  Have any of you messed around with this 432 tuning?

I am curious. I believe you say you tune down a step on the acoustic, so is your plan to tune down to 432 from "standard pitch", or go even lower by tuning guitar to 432 from your "one-step down" pitch?
Mike

[eded]

As many others have said, playing with others means being in a "standard" tuning. Since that "standard" for most is 440, that's what I stick to.  And, I didn't think about it before reading Bowie's comment.... It occurs to me that a different tuning would most likely render my not quite horrible voice unlistenable.

Ed

[mike in lytle]

Wow, great idea.  I've never even seen one in person much less played one.  I did have an octave mandolin for a while.  It got old quick.

You might possibly be a good candidate for a baritone.
Ever played one?

I have a decent mandolin, I struggle with the thin neck, but it is fun to use to accompany myself, in simple ways.
Got an octave mandolin, to be honest, I hated it, and returned it for no loss.
Took a dare on an Irish bouzouki (like an octave, but at a standard guitar scale), and I love it.
I didn't get a cheapo zouk, but really good ones cost a ton. Has a wider neck. And works with the guitar well.
In the future, I will either get a better zouk or even a cittern.
Regarding baritones, they are lovely instruments. Played several, loved them, and considered a purchase. But if part of the tuning equation isn't GDAE or GDAD (mandolin, bouzouki, violin) then it is outside my zone, since the relationship to the guitar is established via EADG or DADG and is easier for me to understand. I don't read music.
Sorry to get off topic.
Mike

[B0WIE]

Sorry to sidetrack, but the "got old quick" subject, that's an interesting one. I almost got a baritone 6 or 7 years ago when they were going through a fad period. Then, I saw so many of them come up for sale used in the couple years following that. I still want one, but I've not been playing enough to justify it lately.

[unclrob]

I think I can make this simple,basically your tuning a half step down across the strings.When I'm just playing and singing a tune by myself I tune a half step down so I can sing in tune.Theres a whole history of how A 440 became standard.




Keep smilin and keep dancin 

[Silence Dogood]

I am curious. I believe you say you tune down a step on the acoustic, so is your plan to tune down to 432 from "standard pitch", or go even lower by tuning guitar to 432 from your "one-step down" pitch?
Mike

Wow, this thread got lively!  Nice!  Yes, I keep my guitar tuned down a whole step at all times (well, not today when I absolutely fell in love with DADGAD, but that's a different thread).  So yes, I'd have to establish the 432 pitch and then go down a full step.  I'm genuinely curious.

My Snark has no pitch-shifting feature on the back. I'll either have to get another tuner or tune off YT till I get one.

 I don't see how this would affect singing anymore than capo usage would?  Since one just has to sing in whatever key is "there."  

The baritone guitar deal really is interesting.  It'll make for some good YT time this week!  Thanks for bringing it up @BOWIE.

[B0WIE]

Wow, this thread got lively!  Nice!  Yes, I keep my guitar tuned down a whole step at all times (well, not today when I absolutely fell in love with DADGAD, but that's a different thread).  So yes, I'd have to establish the 432 pitch and then go down a full step.  I'm genuinely curious.

My Snark has no pitch-shifting feature on the back. I'll either have to get another tuner or tune off YT till I get one.

 I don't see how this would affect singing anymore than capo usage would?  Since one just has to sing in whatever key is "there."  

The baritone guitar deal really is interesting.  It'll make for some good YT time this week!  Thanks for bringing it up @BOWIE.

Singing is largely muscle memory. You can certainly adjust your pitch to what you're hearing, but muscle memory is a strong thing that fills a bigger role in our lives than most people realize. When you're using a capo, everything you sing is still relevant to standard pitch and you have a muscle memory for all the notes in standard. When you shift that slightly, you're completely relying on your ear and may actually be fighting against muscle memory.

Think of living in a house with stairs your whole life. You can probably walk up them in the dark because your muscle memory knows how far apart they are. Move to a house where the stairs are taller and longer, and you won't be able to just go up them so effortlessly at first.

[Silence Dogood]

Singing is largely muscle memory. You can certainly adjust your pitch to what you're hearing, but muscle memory is a strong thing that fills a bigger role in our lives than most people realize. When you're using a capo, everything you sing is still relevant to standard pitch and you have a muscle memory for all the notes in standard. When you shift that slightly, you're completely relying on your ear and may actually be fighting against muscle memory.

Think of living in a house with stairs your whole life. You can probably walk up them in the dark because your muscle memory knows how far apart they are. Move to a house where the stairs are taller and longer, and you won't be able to just go up them so effortlessly at first.

That analogy makes sense.  I'll have to try it out and see how it works.  For now I'm stuck on DADGAD. 

[Queequeg]

Singing is largely muscle memory. You can certainly adjust your pitch to what you're hearing, but muscle memory is a strong thing that fills a bigger role in our lives than most people realize. When you're using a capo, everything you sing is still relevant to standard pitch and you have a muscle memory for all the notes in standard. When you shift that slightly, you're completely relying on your ear and may actually be fighting against muscle memory.

Think of living in a house with stairs your whole life. You can probably walk up them in the dark because your muscle memory knows how far apart they are. Move to a house where the stairs are taller and longer, and you won't be able to just go up them so effortlessly at first.

In North Africa, since ancient times, homes were built such that livestock (sheep, goats) were housed below on the ground floor and the family lived above. The stairs were constructed very irregularly, each of varying height so that during an invasion the attackers couldn't quickly and easily charge up the stairs.

[B0WIE]

In North Africa, since ancient times, homes were built such that livestock (sheep, goats) were housed below on the ground floor and the family lived above. The stairs were constructed very irregularly, each of varying height so that during an invasion the attackers couldn't quickly and easily charge up the stairs.

That's fascinating. I love fun facts about anthropology. Thanks for sharing that.

[Silence Dogood]

Thought I'd post an update and some thoughts on everything that has come up in this thread thus far. 

BOWIE made mention of a baritone guitar, which up till this point had been thoroughly off my radar.  I don't even think I realized there were such things as baritone acoustic guitars, but only electrics.  Tumbling down that rabbit hole made for some really fun YouTube/online research.  The 8-string varieties are really nice! It's like having a mixture between a baritone and a 12-string guitar.  I found a standard baritone made by Ibanez on my local Craig's List and went back and forth with the guy.  I was tempted to buy it for a mere $450, but buying myself something like that at Christmas time just doesn't feel right.  And after thinking it over for several days, my parsimony (which is never far from my heart) got the better of me and I decided to pass on it.  I do really love the idea of a baritone, but I can see it being an instrument that's tucked away and rarely gets played.  I have a really nice Collings mandolin that's been tucked away under a chaise lounge pretty much all year.  I got it out yesterday and the case was covered in dust.  Same goes for my electric guitar (a really nice Jackson model).   These wonderful instruments aren't seeing the play-time they deserve, so me adding another instrument (and one I'd have to spent time learning to play) doesn't make any sense.  The lack of attention my mandolin and electric get are a testament to how much I love my Larrivee, though! 

As for tuning to 432 from 440...  I ended up finding a D'Addario micro clip-on tuner in my electric guitar case.  It has the ability to adjust pitch, so I dropped it down to 432 and tuned my Larrivee to it; then I tuned down a full step from there, since a full step down is my normal thing.  The bottom line for me is that this is my new tuning that I'll be keeping.  I've never had my guitar *FEEL* better than it does in this tuning.  It takes just a tad bit of slack off the strings and really makes it easy to play (easier than it already is tuned down a whole step).  The sound is also really amazing to my ear.  There is this lower, lush aspect of that pitch, like everything just *breathes* a bit more freely. 

I sat around yesterday and sang a bunch of songs in this new tuning.  It was the same as singing in any other key or capo'd position to me.  Maybe my ear/voice is just trained to latch on to whatever key is there, but I had absolutely no issue just singing.  And all the songs were easier to sing with the slightly lower pitch. 

I can't even remember the last time I played guitar with someone else, so an odd tuning isn't an issue for me.  But, yeah, if I were to go and play in a group, etc, I'd need to use standard tuning.  I only have my one acoustic guitar, but I know several of you have a lot of guitars (or at least more than one).  I recommend putting one in this tuning and messing around with it.

Deep state/Nazi/Illuminati conspiracies aside ( ), it's a great and useful tuning that could add another texture/color to your guitar-life. 

Speaking of having more than one guitar... I had so much fun with DADGAD the last couple weeks, I'm thinking seriously of getting a guitar to keep in that tuning.  Going back and forth on my Larrivee is a pain.  Knowing me, I probably won't do it, but it will be fun toying with the idea.  I think something like a Big Baby Taylor would be fun to have for this purpose.  You can get them used for a song, and they are really great little guitars on their own.  If I come across one for $200-$300 on my local CL, I might pull the trigger.  We shall see. 

[StringPicker6]

My telecaster and amp sit unused, and it gives me guilt. I find that although I love the idea of electric guitar, it's a bit boring playing it alone. I'm also very lazy, and I can't be bothered with foot switches and tone knobs.